Garda Síochána (Recording Devices) (Amendment) Bill 2025: Second Stage Dail Éireann — 2025-12-18 ============================================================ Jim O'Callaghan (FF), Dublin Bay South This is the last time I will speak before Christmas. I wish the Ceann Comhairle, all Members and the staff who work here tirelessly throughout the year a happy Christmas. I thank them on my behalf and on behalf, I would say, of all Members of the Oireachtas for their outstanding work. I also want to thank my officials in the Department of justice for their tireless commitment to providing assistance and help to me as Minister. I will deal with a couple of issues raised by Deputies. I would like to respond to everything Deputies said and I will try. Since Deputy Carthy is here, I will reply to what he said. He at one stage criticised me for not bringing in enough legislation and then criticised me for rushing legislation. I do not intend to rush legislation. I have announced a series of important justice legislative provisions I want to see enacted. This is an important one. There have been a number of contributions from Deputies in respect of the reliability of what is referred to as biometric analysis. We need to be clear there is no investigative tool used by the Garda or any of us in life that is infallible. A garda can be looking for an individual and misidentify another individual as that person. Mistakes can be made consistently. However, we cannot ignore the fact there are technological advancements happening of huge benefit to police services for the purpose of investigating crimes. We have looked very much in this debate at the issue from the point of view of a person sought by An Garda Síochána as having been alleged to have committed an offence. We also need to think of it from the point of view of people who are missing. There are people who are missing and it is a terrible trauma for the families involved. This technology will be of huge assistance in enabling the Garda to check for the purpose of identifying where that person is. Similarly, a terrible thing happening in the modern world is the misuse of children for child sexual exploitation. It is going to be extremely beneficial for us to use this technology to identify children who are victims of that heinous crime. I am conscious that much of my work as Minister for justice is devoted to combating domestic, sexual and gender-based violence. If a woman, as it predominantly is, has been raped or seriously sexually assaulted by an individual who is known, there has to be a benefit in having this technology for the purpose of trying to identify where that person is. A garda standing at the top of Grafton Street who is looking for a suspect could be in the difficult position of trying to deal with everyone walking up and down that street. The garda might have been told to keep an eye out for a suspect and arrest them if they see them. That garda can make a mistake but there is a huge benefit in having this type of technology in that we can use the vast amount of footage available to try to analyse biometrically a lot of data to subsequently identify individuals. Deputy Carthy asked the reason for using the term "biometric analysis" and not "biometric categorisation". In fairness, biometric categorisation is a subgroup of biometric analysis. Biometric analysis covers elements of a number of key concepts within the AI Act, including biometric categorisation, but should not be limited to that term. Deputy Carthy and several other colleagues, including Deputy O'Reilly, referred to their concern about racial profiling. Of course, that type of profiling should not be permitted. I assure colleagues that under section 89(3) of the Data Protection Act, profiling is prohibited. That section says that profiling that results in discrimination against an individual on the basis of a special category of personal data shall be prohibited. Deputy Carthy also referred to the fact that a significant number of members of An Garda Síochána would face disciplinary action for the abuse of PULSE. I do not know if it is correct to say a significant number, but the reason for this in legislation, and the reason there will be codes of practice, is to ensure this technology will be used only for what is lawfully permitted under a code of practice. I suspect most of us in this House use this type of facial recognition technology when we accessing our phones or various services. The fact that we are prepared to rely upon it for these purposes should indicate that it is a technology that is improving in its ability. Gabhaim buíochas leis an Teachta Ó Snodaigh freisin. Tá an ceart aige. Dúirt sé go bhfuil a lán ceamaraí CCTV timpeall na cathrach seo agus is féidir leis na gardaí na ceamaraí sin a úsáid agus iad ag déanamh a gcuid oibre. Caitheann na gardaí a lán ama ag scrúdú an footage. Tá an Bille ag freagairt an fhadhb sin. Beidh na gardaí ábalta an footage a scrúdú go tapa nuair a bhíonn siad ag lorg duine amháin sa CCTV. I thank Deputy Ó Snodaigh for his contribution. Deputy Ciarán Ahern referred to the fact that he was concerned about the further extension of this legislation. I have been fairly clear – I am not going to be evasive with colleagues – that it is my intention to introduce further legislation next year for the purpose of trying to put on the Statute Book legislation that will permit retrospective biometric identification and also live biometric analysis and identification. It is of benefit to investigations and will assist the public. The reason I am introducing this is not that An Garda Síochána is saying it wants to use it for itself; it is because it is of benefit in ensuring the best policing service is available to individuals. Deputy Ward made good points. Of course, the technology is not infallible but it is not going to be used as a determinative tool and as determinative evidence meaning a person is going to be convicted of an offence. The worst that could happen is that an individual who is incorrectly identified will be questioned by An Garda Síochána. Every day of the week, people who are completely innocent are questioned by An Garda Síochána in respect of investigations because gardaí may regard them as suspects. Gardaí are lawfully entitled to question people where they have a reasonable suspicion that they have been involved in an offence. In many cases, it turns out that an individual has no involvement whatsoever and is completely innocent, but that does not undermine what the gardaí are doing. Deputy O'Reilly also raised human rights concerns. I have concerns about these also but we also have to consider the human rights of victims of crime and the individuals who are entitled to a thorough investigation. It is not a distraction. The numbers coming into An Garda Síochána are improving. As I said in November, 194 gardaí passed out from Templemore and 200 went in the following Monday. Numbers are looking up. The benefit is more gardaí in every community. An advantage to this legislation is that gardaí will not have to spend days or weeks looking through footage. They will be assisted technologically. Deputy Gannon spoke about state surveillance powers and expressed concerns about the legislation. With regard to state surveillance, this is not a Big Brother state and it does not have a Big Brother government. Nobody in this House is advocating enormous state surveillance. However, we cannot get away from the fact that, around the place, there is a huge number of CCTV cameras and a large amount of footage available. The latter has become enormously advantageous in investigating criminal offences. Part of the reason certain types of crime are declining is that people who commit criminal acts know they will be apprehended owing to there being very significant CCTV surveillance. Deputy Gibney also raised concerns in respect of the technology. She said it is not infallible. I agree. Of course it is not. There is no investigative tool used by An Garda Síochána that is infallible. I listened to Deputies Donnelly and Coppinger. Many Members spoke about studies conducted that indicate the technology is unreliable. Many of these date from 2018 and 2019. The technology has improved immeasurably since then. I believe that any bias that may have existed in terms of race or gender will ultimately be eliminated, but there will always be human verification and human assessment. I wish the Ceann Comhairle a happy Christmas and thank her for all her work. She was not here when I wished people a happy Christmas at the outset. It has been a very busy year for all of us. I wish all my colleagues, particularly the Ceann Comhairle, a happy Christmas. --- Source: Houses of the Oireachtas. Licensed under CC BY 4.0 (https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/). The Official Report is revised after first publication; the fetch timestamp below identifies the version quoted. Record URI: https://data.oireachtas.ie/akn/ie/debateRecord/dail/2025-12-18/debate/main Retrieved: 2026-08-14T04:54:29+00:00 Sitting date: 2025-12-18