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Dail Éireann · 2023-04-27

Ceisteanna ar Sonraíodh Uain Dóibh - Priority Questions · to the Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs

4 questions · 37 contributions · 7 speakers · 4,773 words

In this session

Most used terms in this session

How often each word appears across the whole session, ranked by how distinctive it is to it rather than common to all parliamentary language.

undocumented 13
passport 16
forum 18
special 24
tánaiste 20
classes 14
school 19
consultative 8
irish 22
ncse 8
biden 7
first-time 8

The session in full

Every question in the order taken: the question as tabled, where there is one, then the exchange.

Foreign Policy

Q1 SF Matt Carthy to the Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs

1. Deputy Matt Carthy asked the Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs the stakeholders that will be invited to participate in the consultative forum on international security policy; the criteria that will be applied to select these stakeholders; if the forum will make findings; if so, how those findings will be agreed; if a report will be published arising from the forum's work; who will author such a report; and if he proposes any further actions of the forum, other than the announced public meetings. [19793/23]

FF Norma Foley

The number of Ukrainian students enrolled in schools is set out by county in the table below, at primary and post-primary level, as of 31 March 2023. I regret that I am not in a position to provide statistics at the level of detail requested by the Deputy at this time.

My Department continues to publish figures on the enrolment of Ukrainian children each month. The latest press release of 5 April 2023 is available here: gov.ie - Department of Education confirms 15,282 Ukrainian pupils currently enrolled in Irish schools (www.gov.ie).

The Deputy may also wish to note that the CSO also publishes data on Ukrainian arrivals and enrolments on their database, data.cso.ie on a weekly basis, and the latest data available there is as of 5 April.

Enrolments by county as of 31 March 2023

SF Matt Carthy

The Leas-Cheann Comhairle knows that there is no need to remind me. I always stick within time.

CC Catherine Connolly

We might have a debate on that some other time.

SF Matt Carthy

The question concerns the consultative forum on international security policy the Tánaiste has announced. I am sure he is aware that there are huge concerns that this is a vehicle for the Government to undermine Irish military neutrality and non-alignment, something that has served this State incredibly well over many decades. Will the Tánaiste outline the form the forum will take and how stakeholders will be selected to be invited?

FF Micheál Martin

I do not believe there is huge concern that this is an initiative to undermine military neutrality. It might be a huge concern to some who are contriving that huge concern, but nobody is afraid of debate in this country or of a broad conversation about the international situation in terms of Irish foreign policy and the international security policy of the State.

In order to build a deeper understanding of the threats faced by the State and the links to and between our foreign, security and defence policy, I have convened a consultative forum on international security policy. The consultative forum will take place in three locations: at University College Cork on 22 June; at the University of Galway on 23 June; and at Dublin Castle on 26 and 27 June.

The forum will be open, inclusive, and, as the name suggests, consultative. It will involve a wide range of stakeholders, with participation from civilian and military experts and practitioners. Attendance at the forum will consist of Irish and international participants with expertise and practical experience in the areas to be discussed, as well as members of the public. The Departments of Foreign Affairs and Defence are consulting with academic, civil society, research and State agency partners to identify a wide range of speakers and participants who represent a breadth of experience and views. Discussions will be livestreamed and there will be an option for online submissions. Anyone interested in engaging in the process will be able to do so. Full details of the arrangements for registration, livestreaming and the making of submissions will be published by the Departments of Foreign Affairs and Defence in the coming weeks.

The forum will be chaired by Louise Richardson DBE, formerly vice-chancellor of the University of Oxford and principal and vice-chancellor of the University of St. Andrews, who will produce a report to be delivered following its conclusion. The forum will involve a broad discussion examining the threats we face, including cyber, hybrid, disinformation and threats to critical infrastructure. It will also provide for detailed discussion on Ireland’s work to protect the rules-based international order, through our engagement in peacekeeping, conflict prevention and peacebuilding, as well as arms control and disarmament. Importantly, there are no predetermined or preconceived outcomes from discussions at the forum and participants will be free to raise any relevant issue during deliberations.

SF Matt Carthy

The concerns are genuine and deeply held because Irish neutrality has served us very well. The Tánaiste did not refer to Irish neutrality. It appears the forum will not have a mechanism to analyse how well military neutrality and non-alignment have served us.

The Tánaiste says that his Department will identify potential experts. Who will select those experts and what criteria will be used? The Tánaiste stated that it will be open, but then indicated that members of the public can make submissions online. Will members of the public be able to attend or watch online but not to directly participate in the forum? I will have further questions but ask particularly about the experts and how they will be selected to participate. Everybody knows when dealing with such forums that the selection of experts can skew the tone and direction of debate.

FF Micheál Martin

I regret the knee-jerk antagonistic approach the Deputy is taking to this. As soon as I announced it, the Deputy was out like a flash saying it was a threat to military neutrality. Why is the Deputy afraid of such debate? Why is he afraid of this country having an informed, open and public discussion about broader issues of the international threats facing the world and which Ireland has to work within? This consultative forum is not about a binary choice between military neutrality or joining or not joining an alliance. It is much broader than that. As I have outlined, it will take on board disarmament, as well as peacekeeping and conflict prevention, which have been the hallmark of Irish foreign policy for quite some time.

The Deputy is playing politics with this, banging the drum and playing to a base to the detriment of a genuine, informed public debate, which is healthy in a democracy. The Deputy should not be as opposed to democratic debate as he is. He should not be concerned. I will not try to orchestrate this debate as, perhaps, his party would on many other issues. Be a bit more open and trusting of people.

SF Matt Carthy

Perhaps if the Tánaiste had a better attitude, it would be easier to trust his bona fides on this issue. Nobody is afraid of open public and informed debate. The question I have posed is how the Tánaiste will ensure that these are genuinely open, public and informed debates. He referred to the chair of the consultative forum. I have no doubt Ms Richardson is an able and diligent person with expertise in her own right. Nobody doubts that. She also has very firm views that she has put on the record. The Tánaiste suggested that following the meetings of the consultative forum, Ms Richardson will write the report. There will be no committee. It will be very much her analysis of what is said at the forum. That differs greatly from the citizens' assembly model, which the Tánaiste originally suggested. Perhaps he can correct me on how the final report of the forum will be developed?

FF Micheál Martin

I hope we are not going to go down that path. I anticipated this approach: attack the initiative in an immediate way without giving it due consideration, which the Deputy has done. He immediately attacked it. Now he seems to be focusing on the person, which is wrong.

SF Matt Carthy

I am asking how the final report will be written.

FF Micheál Martin

We are talking about a distinguished academic with tremendous credentials, an Irish person who did exceptionally well and, in my view, is an excellent choice to chair the forum. The chair will be asked to compile a report. There is no preconceived or predetermined outcome. It is a consultative forum. It will be open to the public. The public will be able to attend and people will make online submissions, which is the way of the modern world in terms of technology. Government will consider that and then it comes back into the Oireachtas. We took this approach because we understand parties have positions here. This goes to the core of politics. Though some of the principles of the citizens' assembly are applied here, this is open to political representatives as well. We understand people have different perspectives on issues in international relations.

Undocumented Irish in the USA

Q2 IND Michael Lowry to the Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs

2. Deputy Michael Lowry asked the Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs the outcome of recent discussions he had with the President of the United States and the US authorities during the recent visit to Ireland regarding the need to regularise the status of the undocumented Irish in the US and have an appropriate visa programme put in place to protect them, and the progress made in relation to securing citizenship for them; if he will consider appointing an Irish Government representative who will be solely responsible for dealing with this issue; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [19795/23]

IND Michael Lowry

I ask the outcome of recent discussions the Tánaiste has had with United States authorities and President Biden during his recent visit to Ireland. Did the Tánaiste have the opportunity to raise the need to regularise the status of the undocumented Irish in the United States and the need for the appropriate visa and citizenship programmes to be put in place to protect them?

Will the Tánaiste consider appointing an Irish Government representative who would have sole responsibility for dealing with this issue?

FF Micheál Martin

I thank Deputy Lowry for raising this matter. Addressing the status of undocumented Irish citizens in the US remains a priority for the Government. Immigration matters are raised on an ongoing basis with the US Administration and US political leaders.

The recent visit of President Biden to Ireland reinforced the strong historic, economic, cultural and family links between our two countries. The visit included exchanges with the President on matters of shared importance to both countries, including peace and economic progress on this island.

Immigration matters featured prominently in high-level political engagements during the St. Patrick’s day period. The Taoiseach discussed immigration reform with President Biden at the White House and the need to increase opportunities for young people to move between Ireland and the US with greater ease. I discussed ongoing efforts to secure immigration pathways with Congressman Richie Neal and the Friends of Ireland, and I met with organisations providing vital services and support to our diaspora, including undocumented Irish, in New York and Boston. I also raised the issue on an earlier visit to Washington.

These political contacts build on the ongoing work of our embassy in Washington, in conjunction with bipartisan members of Congress, to find innovative solutions to challenges faced by the undocumented Irish and those seeking to live and work in the US. The most realistic long-term solution for our undocumented citizens remains comprehensive immigration reform, on which the Government actively supports the Biden Administration’s efforts. However, as almost every such legislative proposal in the past decade has stalled in Congress, the challenges should not be underestimated.

My Department supports organisations that provide valued assistance to our citizens in the United States, including the undocumented. More than €4.2 million in emigrant support programme funding was allocated to organisations in the US for 2022 to 2023. Our diplomatic network across the US also proactively seeks opportunities to improve the day-to-day lives of the undocumented Irish.

With respect to an Irish Government representative on immigration, the Minister of State with responsibility for the diaspora, Deputy Fleming, and I have ministerial responsibility for our communities abroad. The Irish Embassy in Washington, together with the eight consulates general throughout the US, remains extremely active on emigration issues.

IND Michael Lowry

As we all know the saga of the undocumented Irish in the United States has been ongoing since what seems like the beginning of time. We have heard endless tales of Irish people who, for many reasons, have chosen to live their lives in the US despite knowing they will never share the same freedoms and benefits as US citizen. Most of them will spend their lives looking over their shoulders. For many people, the lure of the land of opportunity and the centuries-held promise of the American dream are impossible to resist. They follow in their forefathers' footsteps into the cultural melting pot that is the US. Many, even in these modern times, know they may never set foot on Irish soil again. They need the ongoing support of the Tánaiste. They are desperate for protection and a satisfactory resolution.

FF Micheál Martin

I agree. Last year, there was a bipartisan reintroduction of the E3 visa approach in the US Senate and House of Representatives. This is a welcome development. However, the Bill lapsed with the conclusion of the last session of Congress at the end of 2022. We are discussing options how to potentially move forward the Bill into the new Congress. This was a key theme of my meetings when I visited Washington in February. There has to be a bipartisan dimension to this. It is very challenging. On the previous occasion, one vote in the Senate prevented the E3 visa legislation from going through. We had discussions in February. Even on the recent visit, we discussed emigration issues with the delegation that came with President Biden. That delegation included members of Congress and the US Government. It is a very polarising issue in the US politically. This has made it particularly challenging. We continue to work with all state agencies in the US to try to help the undocumented as best we can.

IND Michael Lowry

Few countries around the globe can boast the strong ties of friendship that exist between Ireland and the US. During his recent visit, we witnessed the genuine love that President Biden has for our country and how proud he is of his Irish roots. We know that Ireland holds a cherished place in his heart. We must also be conscious of what the Tánaiste has referred to, which is that America is considered home to undocumented people from many nations around the globe. Realistically, the President's love of Ireland is not enough to change the laws of the US. The political reality is that President Biden and the Democrats do not have the majority required in Congress to make exemptions for Irish people. This can only be achieved with the support of Republicans. In his role as Minister for Foreign Affairs I am glad the Tánaiste is committing to using his network and influence to gain political consensus to achieve a positive outcome for the beleaguered Irish people living illegally in the US.

FF Micheál Martin

The embassy is very seized of this issue as is our ambassador in the US. I favour the approach of our diplomatic network in the US pursuing this issue and not having two strands of approach. I do not want to personalise this but when we appoint people as ambassadors to the US it is experienced high-calibre diplomats who end up in Washington. Over the years they have cultivated strong relationships with both sides on the Hill. This is continuing. When I was last there in February, we concluded an agreement to extend the working holiday visa. I discussed with former Governor and now Secretary of Agriculture Tom Vilsack and others that ideally we have to deal with the undocumented and try to get legislation passed to facilitate them. I have met undocumented people and they are in a very worrying and sad situation. They cannot get back home to family, including to ageing parents or family members who might be sick. It is a very distressing and traumatic experience for many undocumented in the United States. We are very conscious of this and of creating new legal channels between Ireland and the United States for people.

Passport Services

Q3 SF Matt Carthy to the Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs

3. Deputy Matt Carthy asked the Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs the measures in place to ensure that a backlog of passport applications does not emerge in 2023; and the measures he will take to ensure that passports, including for first-time applicants, can be secured in an accelerated manner in urgent and emergency cases. [19792/23]

SF Matt Carthy

What measures is the Tánaiste putting in place to ensure we do not see the backlog of passport applications that we saw in recent years? Will he outline the measures that will be taken to ensure that applicants for passports, particularly first-time applicants, can have access to an accelerated processing of a passport when it is necessary?

FF Micheál Martin

I thank Deputy Carthy for the question. As a result of the strategic planning under way in my Department since last year, the passport service is meeting the current high demand for passports. Almost 350,000 passports have been issued to date in 2023. Just under 1.1 million passports in total are expected to be issued this year. There are no passport application backlogs and all turnaround times are at their target levels.

Staffing remains a priority and recruitment will continue in the coming months. Approximately 100 temporary clerical officers have been assigned to the passport service since January 2023 as well as more than 90 permanent staff. The customer service hub is currently responding to an average of 3,000 queries per day.

The passport service continually works to enhance its services to the public. I am pleased to announce that a number of improvements were made recently to the passport online platform. These improve a customised list of the supporting documents for first-time applicants, an eircode look-up tool to facilitate the input of postal addresses and a new integration feature with the general register office. This integration will benefit a significant cohort of first-time child applicants who will no longer be required to submit a physical birth certificate. These are very welcome innovations. So far, 5,600 digital birth certificates have been received by the passport service. Online continues to be the most efficient way to apply for a passport.

I am pleased to update Deputies further on the MLA portal. This was launched on 17 March with 33 queries received in the first week. The passport service offers an in-person urgent appointment service for passport renewal at its offices in Dublin and Cork. Due to the complex nature of first-time applications, it is not possible to process these at urgent appointments. The passport service has a dedicated team of people who expedite applications in cases of medical emergency or the death of a family member abroad, including for first-time applicants.

FF Norma Foley

The School Transport Scheme is a significant operation managed by Bus Éireann on behalf of the Department of Education. In the current school year, over 147,900 children, including over 18,000 children with special educational needs, are transported on a daily basis to primary and post-primary schools throughout the country.

In addition, school transport scheme services are being provided in the current school year for over 4,500 children who have arrived to Ireland from Ukraine.

The total cost of the scheme in 2022 was €338.9m.

Under the terms of the Primary School Transport Scheme, children are eligible for transport where they reside not less than 3.2 kms from and are attending their nearest primary school as determined by the Department/Bus Éireann, having regard to ethos and language.

For the 2022/2023 school year Bus Eireann received 12 applications for the school referred to by the Deputy. Four of these applications were from eligible families and the remaining eight families were deemed concessionary applications.

Bus Eireann consider the establishment of a route if at least 10 applications are received from eligible families from a distinct location before the application closing date. For the 2022/23 school year this requirement was not met and therefore, the establishment of a service could not be considered.

Families can apply for online at: buseireann.ie/schooltransport. The closing date for applications in respect of the 2023/2024 school year is 28th April 2023 and Bus Eireann will review applications and plan routes during the summer month for the upcoming school year.

FF Micheál Martin

I will be dealing with that matter in more detail later. We are continually focusing on improving the situation for first-time applicants. I have outlined the significant innovations to facilitate that, particularly in terms of birth registration in respect of which there has always been a delay. There will now also be lower costs through avoiding the need for physical birth certificates to be supplied.

The system does have the impact that the Deputy has outlined in terms of applications going to the bottom of the pile, so to speak, but we will continue to work on this to see if we can expedite it even further. To date this year, the turnaround time has been exceptional. I appreciate the Deputy's comments in respect of the staff. The longest call on any one day last week was five minutes. Calls are being responded to very quickly. We will continue to seek to improve services all around.

SF Matt Carthy

This is an area in respect of which we need to improve. I am sure the Tánaiste's office has dealt with such situations. There is nothing worse than someone in a household realising that a passport is out of date or, worse, that there is an understanding of the length of time it takes for a first-time application to be resolved. In that context, I ask the Tánaiste to engage with the Passport Office to arrange for the putting in place of a facility for urgent cases. I accept that the facilities are there in emergency cases. For urgent cases, however, there should be a mechanism whereby first-time applicants can present at the office in order to get an accelerated passport. There can be many instances where that urgency is required. It is one of the final pieces that is required in order to ensure everybody using the passport service has a good experience.

FF Norma Foley

The Education (Student and Parent Charter) Bill has passed all stages of Seanad Éireann, and passed Second Stage in Dáil Éireann on 8th July 2021.

Officials in my Department are continuing to engage with stakeholders including the National Parents Council and the Office of the Ombudsman for Children on matters pertaining to the Bill in advance of the Bill progressing to Committee Stage in Dáil Éireann.

I recently launched Cineáltas: Action Plan on Bullying Implementation Plan 2023-2027 . The implementation plan includes a reference to my Department’s commitment to continue to engage with stakeholders regarding the Charter Bill with a view to progressing the legislation.

Ukraine War

Q4 IND Michael McNamara to the Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs

4. Deputy Michael McNamara asked the Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs if he will outline the European Council meetings at which Ireland agreed to participate in, and fund, the European Peace Facility and the EU military assistance mission in support of Ukraine; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [19794/23]

IND Michael McNamara

Will the Tánaiste outline the European Council meetings at which Ireland agreed to participate in and fund the European Peace Facility and the EU military assistance mission in support of Ukraine?

??

Question No. 277 answered with Question No. 276.

IND Michael McNamara

Those agreements are, of course, not necessitated by membership of the European Union because we have an opt-out, but that does not mean we cannot opt in, in the same way that we opted out of the temporary protection directive and then subsequently opted in, with the approval of the Dáil. In reply to a previous parliamentary question, the Tánaiste told me it is anticipated we will spend €121 million towards the peace facility and the military assistance mission, of which €9.9 million was spent by the end of 2022. My question is not whether the Tánaiste thinks it is morally and strategically correct for Ireland to be involved in this. Clearly, he and his Government do or we would not be involved otherwise. I do not want to go over that. What I want to know is how do these agreements, which are not necessitated by membership of the European Union, not result in a charge upon public funds such as requires the approval of the Dáil. I am not saying the Dáil would not approve it. I am asking how do they not require the approval of the Dáil, because they are agreements and they do result in a charge on public funds.

FF Micheál Martin

In the normal Estimates process, they require the approval of the Dáil.

IND Michael McNamara

Gabh mo leithscéal.

FG Josepha Madigan

I would like to thank the Deputy for the question and would like to advise the following:

Enabling children with special educational needs (SEN) to receive an education appropriate to their needs is a priority for this government.

It is also a key priority for me as Minister for Special Education & Inclusion, for my department and for the National Council for Special Education (NCSE).

For 2023, the spend by my department on special education will be substantially increased by over 10% on last year, meaning that for 2023 my department will spend over €2.6 billion providing supports to children and young people with special educational needs and their schools.

This level of educational funding and support is unprecedented and represents in excess of 27% of the department’s total allocation for 2023.

This includes funding to support children with SEN in mainstream classes; funding for new special classes and new special school places; additional special educational teachers and special needs assistants.

The NCSE has responsibility for coordinating and advising on the education provision for children with SEN nationwide.

My department is engaging intensely with the NCSE in relation to the forward planning of new special classes and additional special school places for the next school year 2023/2024. This work involves a detailed review of statistical data in relation to forecasting demand for special class and special school places, consideration of improved data sharing arrangements, consideration of school accommodation capacity and a particular focus on the provision of special classes at post-primary level.

If the recent growth in the need for special classes continues, it is expected that a similar level of new special classes will be needed at primary level over the next three years as have been provided over the last three years. At post-primary level however, it is expected that we will need to double the number of new special classes being provided over the next three years as compared to the last three years.

As both Minister Foley and I announced recently on 12 April, 2 new special schools are being established for the 2023/2024 school year - one in Carrigtwohill, east Cork and one in the Dublin 7 area - with additional capacity being provided in 11 other special schools.

For the 2023/2024 school year the NCSE have sanctioned 218 new special classes nationwide at primary and post-primary level for the coming school year 2023/2024. Of these new classes, 11 are in Co. Donegal, with 7 at primary level and 4 at post-primary level. These new classes will bring the total number of special classes in Co. Donegal to 108, 64 at primary and 44 at post-primary. Additional special classes will be sanctioned in the coming weeks.

Information on the list of schools with special classes, the types and locations of these classes are available on the NCSE website at www.ncse.ie.

My department is committed, in conjunction with the NCSE, to continue to work with parents, schools, patrons and all stakeholders to ensure that there are sufficient appropriate places for students with additional needs and to support all students to achieve their potential.

As your query refers to an individual placement case, I will arrange to have it referred to the NCSE for their attention and direct reply.

IND Michael McNamara

I accept the Minister's bona fides and that he genuinely believes that it is morally and strategically imperative for us to participate. I accepted that at the outset and that is not what I am questioning. What I am questioning is our own constitutional requirement that any international agreement that imposes a charge on public funds be approved by the Dáil, as well as any participation in war. I noticed that the Minister used the word "war" repeatedly throughout his response in terms of Russia's unjustified war in Ukraine. I appreciate that we are not providing lethal weapons but we are training belligerents, albeit in de-mining. We are providing non-lethal weapons. Again, I question how that does not amount to a participation in war that requires the approval of the Dáil. I am not questioning whether the Minister believes it is strategically and morally correct to do what we are doing. Clearly he believes that genuinely, as does his Government. What I am questioning is whether the constitutional requirements at home are being complied with. The Minister said that we pass the defence Vote but that is not broken down by where we spend the money.

FF Micheál Martin

Yes it is.

FF Norma Foley

As the Deputy is aware this project has been devolved for delivery to Waterford and Wexford Education and Training Board (WWETB).

I can confirm that the Stage 1 report was approved by the Department to progress to Stage 2a in January 2023.

The next steps for the ETB's Design Team will be to progress through Stage 2a (Developed Design) and obtain the statutory planning approvals. When these are in place, the project can proceed to tender and construction. It is not possible at this stage to provide a timeline for the completion of the project. It is a matter for the ETB, as the client for the project, to ensure that this is completed as quickly as possible.

FF Norma Foley

The State Examinations Commission has statutory responsibility for operational matters relating to the state examinations.

In view of this I have forwarded your query to the State Examinations Commission for direct reply to you.

IND Michael McNamara

I accept that.

FF Micheál Martin

That is not training belligerents, to use the Deputy's language. I met representatives of the International Red Cross recently who told me that one of the most appalling consequences of the kind of war that Russia is waging in Ukraine is civilian casualties from unexploded ordnances, mines and bombs that have levelled parts Ukraine. Children can walk into playgrounds and have their limbs amputated-----

IND Michael McNamara

I agree that is wrong and indefensible.

FF Micheál Martin

We want to provide training to give additional de-mining capability to the Ukrainian military. The other area would be that of medical responses to injuries that occur in combat situations.