The Minister of State, Senator Hackett, is very welcome. Senators Murphy and Dolan are sharing time.

On behalf of Senator Dolan and me, I thank the Cathaoirleach for adding this matter to the agenda at short notice. I thank the Minister of State for coming to the House. I know that the Minister of State, Deputy Chambers, is not available. He has been in contact with our offices and will be following up.

Last Friday morning, a colleague of mine, Councillor Marty McDermott, rang me in deep shock. He asked me if I was aware that Roscommon town post office building is to be closed. I could not believe it. I started making inquiries and working on the issue. Regrettably, I found that An Post had reached a decision to close the building. I should make clear that there is no threat to the postal service. There is some confusion over that. This is about the closure of an iconic building that has been there for many years, dating back to the foundation of the State. It is a beautiful building in the square in Roscommon town. The Government has pumped millions into the town to improve it. As Senator Dolan will attest, there are beautiful arrangements in place, and a lot of money has been spent. The Government has spent €20 million on a new water treatment system around the town. All of it is welcome investment. Now, An Post is deciding to close this building.

Why is it so annoying to the people? I will tell Members why. As far as I can establish, this is the first county town in which An Post has decided to do this. It wants to sell off what is a beautiful iconic building and a social hub for people. We are utterly and totally opposed to it. With the councillors on Roscommon County Council and all of our Oireachtas people, we are asking An Post to call this off. It is not on and it is not acceptable. I have no difficulty with the post office business. My issue is not with the business. I have a difficulty with An Post, that is very much supported by the Government, doing something like this when very little is known about it. I will hand over to Senator Dolan, who will take up the story from there.

I thank Senator Murphy for sharing this Commencement matter with me. It is a big issue. We had a meeting with over 12 councillors in Roscommon town only a few days ago. It is frustrating. This is a service and a crucial amenity. I understand that the model has to be looked at, that there is an impact from Brexit and Covid and that we are seeing a lot more in terms of e-commerce, online shopping and retail, but we need to maintain our An Post services, including for financial transactions and money banking. The bill-paying and normal over-the-counter services also need to be considered. They need to be maintained, as Senator Murphy has said, in our county towns.

Is the GPO going to be outsourced to a SuperValu on O'Connell Street? Is that what the plan is? I would love to see that. I note that An Post's corporate services have already moved to the new Exo building at the end of the quays, but is it planning on moving everything out of the GPO? What are we going to do and where do we make a stand? Is An Post seriously going to streamline itself out of existence? The last report published noted that 300 full-time equivalent staff are no longer on the books. The organisation is looking at contracting out to our postmasters, who - do not get me wrong - do an excellent job and are expanding the services. I know there are many pros and cons around the postmasters in terms of co-location, reducing costs, including for heating and security, expanding the services and making buildings accessible. This is an iconic building that has been there since 1911. It is listed in the National Inventory of Architectural Heritage. What happens to that building now? There is a challenge when a listed building is taken on for development for a commercial entity or enterprise. I feel that county towns should retain a direct An Post employee presence and at the moment, this does not appear to be the case.

I thank the Senators for raising this issue. It is a very pertinent issue and one I can relate to, being from County Mayo. I am aware of the importance of the post office in any town. I welcome the opportunity to outline the position on this matter today on behalf of the Minister, Deputy Eamon Ryan, and the Minister of State, Deputy Chambers.

An Post is a commercial State company with a mandate to act commercially. As such, day-to-day operational matters, including decisions in relation to the size, distribution and future of the network, are matters for the board and the management of the company, and not ones in which the Minister or Minister of State has a statutory function. However, the Minister and Minister of State are both very aware of the impact that decisions relating to changes in An Post operations have on communities and individuals in both rural and urban areas. The Department will engage with An Post to outline and highlight the concerns which have been raised by staff, customers and the wider community.

As the Senators have both outlined, this is an iconic building in Roscommon town, and I know how important it is to the people of Roscommon and the wider area. As they have alluded to, in line with its ongoing transformation, An Post announced last week that it proposes converting six post offices from An Post-run to contractor-run, one of which is the Roscommon town office.

Fewer than 40 post offices of a total of more than 900 across the State are now run directly by An Post. An Post has outlined that the change in business model of the six offices will not in any way change the range or extent of the services offered by An Post in those selected locations and the company remains committed to providing each area with the highest standard of services for the future. An Post has advised that staff employed at the post offices in question will have options, including taking up the employment as the new postmaster or being redeployed within the network.

The Government's objectives for the An Post network include harnessing the opportunities presented by e-commerce and the digital economy and delivering a sustainable nationwide post office network at the heart of communities, offering a range of e-commerce, financial and Government services. The Government agreed that an amount of €10 million per annum will be provided by the Department of the Environment, Climate and Communications over a three-year fixed term to support the postmasters, with funding to be disbursed across the post office network. The funding is being paid monthly for each 12-month period. Over €9.7 million has been claimed by An Post for 2023 for the postmaster network.

The programme for Government recognises that a modernised post office network will provide a better range of financial and e-commerce services for citizens and enterprise as part of its commitment to a sustainable nationwide post office network. The overall €30 million in funding being provided to support a sustainable nationwide post office network is in line with this commitment. That commitment is valid. It is good the modernise the post office system but, in saying that, I do appreciate the concerns regarding this particular building and moving the post office out of it.

I acknowledge that the Ministers are going to become involved in this. That is crucially important. My Oireachtas colleagues and I are working on getting a meeting with the Minister of State, Deputy Jack Chambers, and I believe that is going to happen.

This is a listed building. I know the Minister of State has a great interest in heritage herself. I do not want it sold off. As a listed building, there will be limitations on what can be done with it. We all know that. If the building is not efficient, surely there are ways An Post can make it more efficient in light of all of the schemes out there. This is a crucial issue for the people of Roscommon town and the county. As I said, it is a hub and a meeting place. It may be more used by older people as many young people do not use the post office. It is beautiful and very well-received in the area and the staff are excellent and interact in a great way. I have to hand back to Senator Dolan, but I thank the Minister of State for being here.

I know the Minister of State is taking this debate on behalf of the Minister of State, Deputy Jack Chambers. My colleague Senator Murphy is going to be working with the Minister of State and me. I have raised this issue with our parliamentary party and with the Taoiseach's office. It is crucial that we look at our long-term strategy. I know €10 million a year is being allocated from An Post, but is that just for the postmasters? What happens to services directly employed by An Post? How do we maintain them? What is the long-term strategy? How do we ensure that services are on main streets in town centres? What service provider is going to pay extra for rent on the main street when he or she could pay half the price four or five miles up the road? What is An Post going to do about these listed buildings? If someone decides to take on this contract, how is An Post going to support him or her to maintain the post office in the same location and perhaps to expand the building to make sure it is fit for purpose for people in the town and for the employees? More needs to be done and to be looked at.

Before I call on the Minister of State, I note that I do not see any statement on this circulating.

I have copies here. No one ever came up to me to ask for them.

That is okay. Members can get them when they go out.

I appreciate the concerns about this. I cannot really speak to what the plans are for this particular building but, as the Senators have said, it is an iconic building in the town and it has a great connection with the community. It is important that, whatever happens, the post office remains a central facility for people in the town to use. An Post tells me that the services will remain the same wherever the post office is located and that there will not be any falling back on the services. That is important because, in my own area, I have seen towns and villages that have lost services entirely. I will bring the Senators' concerns about the building back to both Ministers and see if there are any plans that can be shared.

Before I go any further, I welcome a transition year student from Portarlington, Conor Dunne, who is here for a two-week placement. He is very welcome.

I thank the Minister of State for being here to take this matter. I appreciate having the opportunity to talk about something very positive, although I am looking for some more detail on its implementation. This is very important for commuters in south Kildare, Drogheda, Wicklow and parts of Meath. Since my election to the Oireachtas, I have advocated very strongly for better commuter fares for south Kildare. The population in Kildare has grown a great amount over recent years. Because of the price of accommodation, rent and housing in Dublin, many people who are working or studying there travel from Kildare every day. It is really important that we get the whole area of public transport right. It needs to be accessible and affordable. I have worked closely with the NTA and the Minister of State, Deputy Jack Chambers, in recent years. Of course, the Minister, Deputy Eamon Ryan, represents this whole area at Cabinet.

Our main issue related to the differential between the fares from Sallins, which is the short-hop zone, and from the next stop, Newbridge, which is outside that zone. The differential there was very big. People were basically bypassing Newbridge Station to park in Sallins, keeping cars on the road when what we all want to do is to keep them off the road and to have people use public transport, which is something I know the Minister of State is very committed to. The launch of the new national fares strategy by the NTA was certainly a very positive step in the right direction in bringing greater price equity to local commuters. We waited a number of months to find out what the final fare would be. Last week's announcement was really important for the people I represent. The reduction in a single adult fare from Newbridge is 45%, which is very significant. People in Kildare town will see a 37% reduction. This new outer Dublin commuter zone is really important. We had the Minister of State, Deputy Jack Chambers, down the week before to put another bit of pressure on. We have had a number of false dawns but are now really on the way towards providing a better deal for local commuters. Under the new determination, the single fare from Newbridge to Dublin will be €6 while the same fare from Kildare town will be €7.50. It is a great win and I am really glad to have played a part in it. I pay tribute to Jennifer Caffrey and the short-hop zone lobby group, who have done a lot of work over the last two years to keep the pressure on with regard to this issue.

We are obviously very keen to ensure this is implemented as soon as possible. As soon as we have a very positive announcement, all of the questions come along. Most importantly, when are we going to see these fares being put in place? We want to see them as a matter of urgency. Commuters in Newbridge and Kildare have been paying multiples of what their peers in Sallins pay for years so we want to see this rectified as soon as possible. We also want to see town buses in Newbridge and Kildare that will collect people in estates and bring them to the train. We want to see the new carriages that have been committed to and integrated ticketing being brought in as part of next generation ticketing. However, the most immediate issue is the timing and ensuring that these fares are implemented as soon as possible.

I thank Senator O'Loughlin for her Commencement matter, which I am taking on behalf of the Minister for Transport. I welcome the opportunity to discuss this important topic.

I want to clarify that the Minister has responsibility for policy and overall funding as regards public transport, but neither the Minister nor his officials are involved in the day-to-day operation of public transport services. The statutory responsibility for securing the provision of public transport services nationally rests with the National Transport Authority, NTA. The NTA works with the public transport operators, which deliver the services and have responsibility for day-to-day operational matters.

That said, I reassure the Senator that the Government is strongly committed to providing all citizens with reliable and realistic sustainable mobility options. Public transport clearly plays a key role in the delivery of that goal.

To support that objective, under budget 2024, a funding package of €613 million has been secured for public service obligation and Local Link services. This package includes funding for the continuation of the 20% fare reduction on PSO services, the extension of the young adult card on both PSO and commercial bus services to include 24- and 25-year-olds, and the continuation of the 90-minute fare until the end of 2024. Funding has also been secured to support the continued roll-out of new and enhanced bus and rail services this year.

As part of the programme for Government, we committed to review existing fare structures to ensure that public transport is as accessible as possible, supports the delivery of services and incentivises off-peak travel.

In its capacity as fare regulator, on 27 April 2023, the NTA published a new national fares strategy. Following that, on 18 January 2024, it published the first of a series of fares determinations related to the strategy. The Senator's question is about the timeline for the implementation of this fares determination and, in particular, when those living in areas such as Kildare and Newbridge can expect to see a roll-out of the new Dublin commuter zone and a reduction in their fares.

The most significant change in this year's fare determination is the implementation of an initial phase of the national fares strategy on Dublin commuter bus and rail services. This will deliver more consistent and equitable fares and reduce the disparities which currently exist for some passengers, particularly in the outer commuter towns surrounding Dublin. The Dublin commuter zone to which Senator O'Loughlin refers will extend from the outer edge of the Dublin city zone to approximately 50 km from the centre of Dublin and includes areas such as Naas, Kildare and Newbridge. The Dublin commuter zone fare is designed to ensure that the cheapest fare is made available for passengers and will help to alleviate boundary issues between the national and city fare structures. For example, for a journey from Newbridge to O'Connell Street, passengers will benefit from the flat-fare element within the city facilitating longer distances of travel at a cheaper fare. For journeys entirely within the Dublin commuter zone, the standard national fare structure will apply.

The Senator asked about the when. I am advised that it is expected that the new fare structure will come into operation on the Dublin commuter services by the end of quarter 3 of 2024. In the interim, the existing fare structure will continue to apply.

This fare determination represents the first step in delivering the national fares strategy, and it is the NTA's intention to roll this out further across the country in future determinations in the months ahead.

Obviously, this is good news. It is certainly good news for many who will be using this. The Minister of State has clarified that it will probably be the end of September before this comes in. I know it will not be long coming. It is always a little painful when something is announced and you have to wait quite some time before it comes in. I do appreciate that the implementation comes down to the NTA, but the Government plays a very important part in setting the policy and ensuring that the money is put in place.

I take on board too what the Minister of State says about being strongly committed to providing all citizens with reliable and realistic mobility options and the fact that she mentioned Local Link. Local Link is hugely important in ensuring that people get to the point from which they can travel to the city. I ask the Minister of State to take all of that on board in terms of all the supports that need to be put in place.

The Senator is right that the whole thing has to be integrated and connected. The call for Local Link to bring people to the train stations is an important aspect of this. It is something I will bring back to the Minister, Deputy Ryan. I understand the wait is a challenge but, as the Senator says, this is good news for these towns. I hope it is the start of something we will see rolled out further.

I remind Senators that more and more people are using public transport. I think the reduction of fares we have seen over recent years has been a real driver of that, but also, people are changing. We have a young man from Portarlington in the Gallery. I trust he got the train up from Portarlington because that is a very good service too.

I thank the Senator for the Commencement matter. This is a good news story.

I thank the Minister of State for taking time from her busy schedule to be with us this morning. We appreciate it.

We await the arrival of a Minister of State to take our next Commencement matter. We will suspend the House for three minutes while we wait for the Minister of State to arrive. Is that agreed? Agreed.