The Minister of State, Deputy Cummins, is very welcome to Seanad Éireann.

The Minister of State is very welcome to the House. The matter I am raising is one I have raised regularly in the House and which has been raised very regularly with me by members of community youth groups like the No Name Club and Foróige and I have also observed it myself. It is the proliferation of vaping, especially vape shops, across every town and village in Ireland. It happened very quickly, so obviously regulation has not caught up with it. My point this morning is that tobacco regulations should be expanded to include vaping products. Just yesterday evening I noticed in a shop that the space behind the counter where the tobacco advertising used to be, which is now concealed and covered, displays branding for disposable vapes. We need to remove single-use vapes but we also need to remove the product placement from such prominent positions in shops, as this encourages vaping.

We do not know the health risks of it. We did not know the health risks of tobacco in the early days but we have learned how devastating that was. We do not know what the full effects of vaping may mean in the long term. It needs to be treated very seriously and that is why I have raised it. A key aspect is the placement of the products, particularly in shops that are dedicated to vaping and encouraging the use of vaping products. The association with candy and sweets is clearly a cynical move to target young people in particular to use it as a stepping stone or to get them addicted to vaping products. We need to have strong regulation on this and treat it like tobacco. People can still have a choice but vaping cannot be proliferated and done in a cynical way that is targeting young and vulnerable people. As well as that, the variety of flavours is very targeted at young people and tries to make it as accessible and attractive as possible even though this is an addictive substance.

I would welcome support on tackling this, tackling the decline of our high streets due to presence of these vaping shops and also the cynical efforts being made to attract our young people to vaping. I welcome the Minister of State's feedback on it.

Before the Minister of State responds we welcome visitors from St. Cronan's Junior National School in Swords. They may not be aware that the rule in Seanad Éireann is that if there is a visiting school there is no homework for the rest of the week. They might not have homework for the rest of the week but they can carry it over. For the teachers there is no work during the school holidays either. You are all most welcome to Seanad Éireann and thanks for coming.

Anois, an Aire Stáit.

I too welcome the students to the House. I hope they have an enjoyable day in Leinster House.

I thank Senator Duffy for raising this very important matter, which I am taking on behalf of the Minister for Health. Nobody can deny we have seen an increase in vaping in recent years, particularly among young people. Work is already under way to tackle it. The Senator specifically raised the issues of regulation of retailers and the marketing of these products to young people, so I will focus on those in my response.

First of all, the Public Health (Tobacco Products and Nicotine Inhaling Products) Act 2023 brought in a minimum age of sale of 18 for nicotine inhaling products and will introduce a licensing system for the retail sale of tobacco and nicotine inhaling products. Currently there is a one-off registration system for tobacco and no registration system for the sale of nicotine inhaling products such as vapes. This has led to vapes being sold in the likes of sweet shops, butchers, phone repair shops and fast food takeaways. From February 2026, retailers will have to apply annually for a licence, including a declaration that they comply with all relevant law in this area.

There will be increased penalties for retailers who commit offences, including minimum licence suspension periods and revocation of the licence entirely for retailers who commit two or more serious offences, such as selling to a minor. This Act will also prohibit the sale of tobacco and nicotine inhaling products from self-service vending machines and events aimed at children, and licences will not be granted to temporary or moveable premises, such as those at festivals.

Regarding the marketing of nicotine inhaling products, advertising of these products is already prohibited online, in print, on TV and on radio. The 2023 Act expanded this to include restrictions near schools, on public transport and in cinemas. The Government is taking regulation of the retail environment and restrictions on marketing further in legislation that is currently being drafted by the Minister for Health. The public health (nicotine inhaling products) Bill will require shops to hide nicotine inhaling products in the same way as they do for tobacco so that they are out of sight in shops where children may be present. As with tobacco, this will not apply to shops that only sell nicotine inhaling products. However, the legislation will also introduce an advertising ban in all retail premises where nicotine inhaling products are sold.

It will also regulate the actual product characteristics to reduce their appeal to young people. This includes restrictions on the use of colours and imagery on devices and their packaging so that any products on display or seen by young people are not brightly coloured or covered in cartoons. It will also include a ban on devices which resemble toys or games, which the Senator referenced in his opening remarks, for the same obvious reasons. The Bill will significantly restrict the flavours available for sale and ensure only basic flavour names are used. The Bill will also prohibit the sale of single-use vapes, as these are disproportionately used by young people, not to mention the environmental impacts associated with them.

In short, the Government has already taken steps in this area, but there are more items to progress. The Minister hopes the Senator and colleagues in this House will support the upcoming implementation of the 2023 Act and the new proposed legislation when it comes before the Oireachtas.

I thank the Minister of State, Deputy Cummins, for a very positive reply. I welcome all of the proposals. The minimum age for the nicotine inhaling products has been very welcomed, but to limit the retail sale of it in areas such as shops, butchers and phone repair shops, where it is clearly being cynically targeted at young people, is where we need to tackle it most. I am pleased with the reply. My main question is when this may take effect. The reply is 100% satisfactory, very welcomed and I am very pleased by it. I look forward to seeing this introduced as soon as possible. When will this take effect? All of the measures here will have a marked difference and improvement on public health and, it is hoped, will reduce the uptake of vaping by young people.

I thank the Senator for raising what is a very important issue. The Minister is committed to bringing this legislation forward. The Senator rightly pointed out that the targeting of young people by the tobacco and nicotine industries is not a new issue, and that is why we as Government are committed to tackling issues such as the single-use vapes, advertising and the display of these products to protect our young people and our population. There has been a huge increase in shops across Ireland selling vapes and we want to tackle that. The measures the Minister is looking to bring forward are a proactive step in the right direction. We want as a Government to ensure we have achieved the target of less than 5% of the population smoking. Everything the Minister, Deputy Carroll MacNeill, is doing in the space of health is in the form of proactive measures to protect people. We look forward to working with this House and the Dáil in progressing those changes.

The Minister of State will stay with us for the next Commencement matter.

I have been recently notified by Cavan County Council that it is pausing the private housing grant applications for the moment due to high demand. This refers to the housing adaptation grant, the mobility aids grant and the housing aid for older people grant. These grants are vital to make changes or improvements to homes to accommodate changing needs which may occur due to ageing and mobility issues as a result of ageing, accident or illness. It also makes it possible for older houses to continue to be liveable in respect of electrics, windows and doors, a leaky roof or so forth. These grants make it possible for people to continue living in their own homes and frequently make changes that allow life to be easier and accidents less likely to happen.

The county council is pausing applications with immediate effect so it can prioritise those with most need. At the moment, it is going forward by prioritising those with priority 1 status, those who require adaptions to allow them to leave hospital or a residential setting, or those who are terminally ill or dependent on a carer or family. However, even that aspect is funding-dependent. The county council hopes it is only a temporary measure but that is dependent on accessing increased funding.

It is quite early in the year to pause the grants. Last year, the council spent €2.2 million, but this year its allocation was only €1.8 million, which is still a considerable amount but it is not as much as it received last year. Last year, it received a top-up. It got €1.3 million last year but then received a top-up to bring it up to €2.2 million. The council told me that last year it approved 239 grants and this year, so far, 293 grants have been approved.

A little bit of it is a throwback to Covid because grants were being passed at the time and then construction could not be carried out because of restrictions, or the construction workers were not there to do the work. That, thankfully, has changed. The work is being done and the money needs to be paid out. Perhaps in a year or two, there will not be as much demand. We have to recognise as well that the grant system opened up the eligibility criteria, increasing it, and the thresholds increased, which means it has consequences. We also have an ageing population, which also has consequences. There will be need for increased funding for these grants as well as the council’s aspect that it spends an increased amount.

Is there a possibility a top-up will be given to Cavan County Council in order for it to ensure it can honour the grants it has approved and it continues to honour the priority 1 grants and, it is hoped, some of the others? I will give an example. One woman, who is 81 years of age, hoped to have the bath taken out of her house and get a level access shower. She applied for the grant last year but, unfortunately, her application seems to have gone missing. I had to sit down with her and do the application again and get all the information in, only to find the grants are being paused. For her, it means that if she slips in that bath, which is what she is terrified of, she could end up breaking a hip, needing hospitalisation or needing residential care. If, however, the level access shower can be provided now, that could prevent a very serious accident happening. I have other examples of people who are looking to replace windows and doors and were hoping to get it done before the winter, but now that is not a possibility. People who may have dangerous electrics in their home need to have them replaced, and that is not a possibility. A lot of work that could be carried out now could prevent more work being needed down the line if accidents occur or if the home deteriorates.

I thank Senator Tully for raising this important matter and allowing me the opportunity to provide an update to the House. My Department provides funding to local authorities under the housing adaptation grants for older people and disabled people scheme to assist people in private houses to make their accommodation more suitable for their needs.

The suite of grants includes the housing adaptation grant for disabled people, the mobility aids grant and the housing aid for older persons grant, which are now 85% funded from the Exchequer, with a 15% contribution from the resources of the local authority, under the revised scheme which commenced from 1 December of last year. The detailed administration of these schemes, including assessment, approval, prioritisation and allocation, is a responsibility of local authorities.

In 2024, Exchequer funding of €74.5 million was initially allocated. Additional funding was secured for the scheme through a Supplementary Estimate of €8 million, resulting in Exchequer funding of €82.6 million overall. Over €103 million was allocated when this was including the local authority contribution, which was 20%, facilitating the payment of more than 15,000 grant claims. The Exchequer funding available for these grants in 2025 has been increased substantially by €25 million to €99.5 million, or over €117 million when accounting for the local authority contribution, continuing the year-on-year increases in funding that have occurred since 2014.

Local authorities were recently informed of their 2025 allocations, with each local authority receiving a substantial increase on the 2024 allocation. Cavan County Council received an Exchequer allocation of €1.86 million for 2025, an increase of 36% on the initial allocation of €1.37 million for 2024. This is actually €2.19 million when the council contribution is included.

In 2024, the county council received an allocation of €1.7 million, comprising €1.37 million funding and over €300,000 to be funded from the local authority's own resources. An additional allocation of €430,000 was allocated to Cavan County Council from the Supplementary Estimate, totalling an Exchequer spend of €1.8 million, or €2.26 million when including the local authority contribution.

The Department advises local authorities annually that, as far as practicable, a percentage of the allocation under the schemes should be ring-fenced in respect of any emergency applications that might arise under these schemes during the course of the year. Consequently, all local authorities manage their schemes to ensure access to the grants programme is maintained to the greatest extent possible throughout the year on a priority basis. I welcome the fact Cavan County Council continues to proactively prioritise applicants most in need, namely, those priority one applicants, such as individuals who are terminally ill, are primarily dependent on family or a carer, or where home adaptations would support them leaving hospital or residential care.

I acknowledge the representations made by Senator Tully with regard to her local authority in Cavan. As a Government, we are committed to supporting local authorities throughout the year in managing their allocations, as we have done every year to date.

I thank the Minister of State. As he noted, that tallies with what the council has been informed of and I know additional funding was provided last year. I am really asking whether there is a possibility that can happen again this year. I know the council has made an application for additional funding to the Department. The council is willing to try to come up with the matching funding of 15% within the council. It has to managed to do that even though it has put a fair burden on the council, because it realises the importance of these grants and the importance of honouring the priority one grants, in particular, by ensuring it has sufficient funds to cover those applications. The council does not know the volume of grant applications with priority one status requiring work to be done to a home yet to be sent to the office. Will the Minister of State give an indication as to whether additional funding will be made available this year, as it was last year? The funding will be put to good use. I understand Cavan County Council is probably not the only local authority looking for additional funding. I know a number of them did not spend their allocations but the vast majority did and required more funding.

The information I have is that Cavan County Council has drawn down €1.5 million of its €1.86 million allocation and, with that 15% local authority contribution, it has resources of €2.19 million to spend this year. Our Department works closely with every local authority to maximise drawdown under the scheme. That does mean any underspends that arise in other local authorities can be redistributed to local authorities that have high levels of grant activity in an effort to redistribute them. Given the benefits of the schemes, which I see in my county of Waterford in terms of drawdown, and the difference they make to communities, families and individuals on the ground, we want to see a maximum drawdown of allocations. We will continue to work with local authorities in respect of their allocations.

The Curragh Camp is a very special place in County Kildare and nationally. It was a thriving community but is not so much now, sadly, because a lot of facilities have been moved from there and a lot of the accommodation for married people and families is no longer available. At the same time, many families were reared in the Curragh Camp. There is still a military community and two schools are still operating from there.

My Commencement matter relates to two iconic buildings. The camp dates back to around 1855 and was used during the Crimean War by the Royal Engineers. It was later expanded with a permanent barracks, a post office, a fire station, churches, a water tower and a courthouse. The post office itself is of considerable social and historic importance because it was the first purpose-built post office completed in Ireland after Dublin's GPO. It was constructed in 1899 and there is a preservation order on the building. It became a template for numerous other Irish post offices and served not just the Curragh Camp community but the surrounding villages like Brownstown, Suncroft, Gormanstown, etc., until July 2019, when the then postmaster retired. Facilities were moved to a modern facility so, thankfully, the service itself was not lost to the Curragh Camp and surrounding areas. It is an absolutely beautiful building and has been unused since 2019, after 119 years of service. Since the building closed, it has suffered vandalism and deterioration, which we see all too often with vacant buildings. Kildare County Council had to take enforcement action to ensure some of the building was boarded up. It is very important that a plan be put in place for this iconic building, which is in the heart of the Curragh Camp.

The fire station was built not long after the post office. It was erected around the year 1900. It is a five-storey red-brick fire station with a very prominent, six-storey water tower. It was among the very first of Ireland's purpose-built fire stations and was built extremely well. It has a very imposing tower that makes it a centrepiece of the Curragh Camp civic square. Local people talk about being born under the shadow of the tower. It was a very important building, both in terms of the service it provided and the structure itself. Sadly, the fire services are no longer based there, as of only last month. That was a military decision, taken due to the working time directive. I do not propose to get into that issue now but I think that the decision was an absolute shame. Fire services do continue to be operated by Kildare County Council as a replacement but are not based at the Curragh Camp fire station.

These are two very fine buildings, and people who live in the Curragh now and also those who come from families who originally lived there are very concerned about these two iconic buildings. Is there a plan for them?

Before I call the Minister of State, Deputy Cummins, I welcome to the Gallery the Minister of State at the Department of Justice, Home Affairs and Migration, Deputy Niall Collins, and his guests, who are from Lough Gur National School, County Limerick. As tradition goes, the pupils will have no homework for the week. I also welcome the guests from Gaelscoil Éadan Doire, who are guests of Deputy Shónagh Ní Raghallaigh. As tradition goes, they too will have no homework for the week.

I, too, welcome the students and hope they have an enjoyable day here in Leinster House.

I am responding to Senator O'Loughlin on behalf of the Tánaiste and Minister for Defence, who unfortunately cannot be present here today. He asked me to pass on his apologies to the House. I welcome the opportunity to respond and I thank Senator O'Loughlin for her question. I am very familiar with the Curragh Camp as I had a cousin who was an officer in the Defence Forces and have a friend who lives in close proximity to the camp. I am aware of how loved the Curragh Camp is by the community and of the special regard in which it is held, so it is appropriate that I can fill in for the Tánaiste in responding on this matter.

The post office building in the Defence Forces Training Centre, which was a feature of the military installation for many years, was, as the Senator rightly pointed out, closed in July 2019. The Department of Defence was not involved in the decision to discontinue its use as a post office. As this building is within an active military installation, its long-term use will be determined first and foremost by the military authorities.

To further progress the development of Defence Forces infrastructure more quickly and increase economies of scale, it is planned to develop a series of master plans for each installation to future-proof for the next 20 to 30 years. This approach will identify from the outset the infrastructure requirements in line with capability development for each installation, including the Defence Forces Training Centre, with associated prioritisation of projects and a phased timeline for delivery.

The future plans for the building will be considered within the context of the master planning process for the Defence Forces Training Centre, which is due to begin next year. In that context, the future use and any associated refurbishment works for this building will be determined by the Defence Forces in the context of their operational requirements.

Of course, with regard to any works which may be required to safeguard the architectural importance of the building, the Department and the military authorities will be guided by Kildare County Council. This collaborative approach has worked very successfully with Dublin city and Cork county councils in relation to major renovation projects for important historical buildings in McKee Barracks and at Block 8 on Haulbowline Island. I am advised that some remedial works were carried out in 2022 to ensure the structural integrity of the building.

With regard to the fire station in the Curragh Camp, to which the Senator referred, I am advised that in December 2024 the Department was informed an operational decision had been taken by the military authorities to proceed with the closure of the Defence Forces Training Centre fire station. The fire service was formerly operated by the Defence Forces Engineer Corps. I understand there has been some discussion about the repurposing of the fire station building for other uses by the Engineer Corps; however, a final decision on this matter will be made in the context of the future master planning of the Defence Forces Training Centre.

I thank the Senator for raising these important matters. I know of the two buildings in question and have seen them, and I am aware that the post office is of historical importance in the area. I look forward to the master planning exercise and working with the military authorities on developing their plans.

I thank the Minister of State for his response. I know he has a sense of the historical, social, cultural and architectural importance of both buildings. I am pleased about this and that he recognises the buildings' significance.

I acknowledge that the Department of Defence was not involved in the decision to discontinue the use of the post office. The decision on the fire station was a military one also. Nevertheless, because the two iconic buildings are in the Curragh Camp, in respect of which the Department of Defence works closely with the military authorities, it is important that we have a plan in place. The response I have just been given about the plan to develop a series of master plans for each installation to future-proof for 20 to 30 years is very welcome. It would be helpful to get a timeline on that down the line. I appreciate that the Department's decisions will have priority in this area.

It is really good that the water tower and fire station are being considered for engineering space. There has been talk about the possibility of using the post office as a medical centre. I assume that, in the planning, there will be an opportunity to make proposals. I am pleased that the buildings will not be left to rot, because there is enough dereliction around the Curragh Camp. It is important that we do everything to preserve the two buildings and go further with others.

I thank the Senator. I assure her that the Tánaiste is committed to radically overhauling the built environment for the Defence Forces throughout the country. The historical importance of the Curragh Camp to many members of the Defence Forces, their families and the wider local community is fully understood. In that context, several capital works are ongoing at the Curragh Camp training centre, at various stages of construction, tender procurement, design and planning. These form part of the Defence Forces infrastructure development plan, which sets out a programme of project delivery for the years 2023 to 2027. Through that, the Department is investing some €50 million in national Defence Forces infrastructure, with a further €12.5 million being provided to the Defence Forces on a fully delegated basis to maintain the current building stock.

I emphasise that the future master planning exercise will be important in identifying future uses for the buildings the Senator referred to and in ensuring we have modern fit-for-purpose infrastructure for members of our Defence Forces, who serve our country with distinction day in, day out.

Before we move on to the next Commencement matter, I welcome the pupils from Kiltale National School, County Meath, who are guests of Deputy Aisling Dempsey. As tradition goes in the Seanad, there will be no homework for the rest of the week.

I also welcome to the House Senator Pat Casey's guests: Pat Vance and Barry Ryan. Everyone else in the Gallery is also very welcome to the House today.

The Minister of State is very welcome to the House. I, too, welcome Senator Pat Casey's guests, namely Pat and Barry, and the school pupils. I hope they have a very enjoyable day here.

One of the many difficult aspects of the current housing crisis is the availability of funds for investment in housing and, indeed, many other projects. Government finance has accelerated over recent years but it is simply not enough without the support of considerable finance from other sources. That there is almost €170 billion in savings on deposit in Ireland, which under the right circumstances could be better utilised to fund much-needed infrastructure projects, including those associated with energy, water, transport, sewerage and housing, all of which are vital in supporting the development of housing, surely presents an opportunity worth exploring. Surely a way must be found in order that citizens' funds on deposit, which in many cases are earning little or no interest, can be invested in major infrastructure projects. We are grappling with the housing crisis, which is marked by increasing rents, a shortage of supply and rising homelessness. Irish deposits are an untapped resource that deserves long-term planning.

Figures from the CSO this week show that, before adjusting for seasonality and inflation, Irish households saved a whopping €8.2 billion in the first three months of this year alone. It is a staggering amount of money. Compare this with the record €5 billion allocated for housing in 2024.

Irish households are saving billions which could and should be channelled into a State-backed housing and infrastructural investment scheme for the long-term gain of the State. A State-backed housing investment vehicle to allow households to invest their savings in housing developments and infrastructural projects was first put forward by the Society of Chartered Surveyors Ireland some time ago. Such an initiative, similar to schemes already in operation in countries like France, would enable the Government of the day to put long-term, multi-annual plans in place which also facilitate investment in much-needed infrastructural projects and access to finance, especially for small and medium-sized developers for whom finance still remains a major barrier.

The State is by far the largest investor in Ireland’s housing delivery. However, the level of public investment is not sustainable in the long-term, and alternative funding streams need to be examined. My colleague, Barry Andrews MEP, having produced a policy paper back in 2023 on housing which investigated systems across the EU, came up with an option that he and many others recommend called Livret A, which is a French investment saving scheme. This scheme shows that excess household funding can be channelled into something positive. In France, almost all the people have a type of state-backed savings account. It is a tax-free way of saving money up to a maximum amount which is available through any bank and offers savers a more attractive interest rate than their usual account would do. This interest rate is significantly above that offered by the current bank. These savings are managed by a special state-investment vehicle such as a public bank. It helps finance projects that support public goals, including both infrastructural and social projects, but the largest single recipient is the French social housing model. Now, although in France, like in many other European countries, they are grappling with the housing shortage, funding, apparently, is not a problem. A savings fund of this nature could underpin long-term planning by providing the multi-annual funding commitments that housing projects and many other infrastructure projects require. It seems to me to make perfect sense that, where we have an untapped resource of €170 billion that makes no money whatsoever for Irish savers, that money could be channelled into much-needed funding for infrastructural projects we need to get up and running as soon as possible.

I thank Senator Gallagher for raising this issue today, which I am taking on behalf of the Minister for Finance, Paschal Donohoe, who sends his apologies to the House.

As I understand it, the proposal is to utilise individual savings in financial institutions to fund infrastructure provision in the State and that this could result in higher returns for depositors than are currently paid by financial institutions. As regards the proposal, I would say any intention to use existing deposits for the purposes proposed would mean the borrowing of such funds by the State from depositors. Such borrowing would ultimately have to be repaid by the State. There is no obvious financial model whereby borrowings from individual depositors in banks to fund infrastructure such as water or sewerage projects are repaid other than from existing State revenues. Borrowing, therefore, would add to the existing level of debt incurred by the State and increase its financial obligations in repaying such borrowing. Given the economy operates at nearly full capacity, increasing borrowing and expenditure may lead to poor value outcomes in the development of infrastructure, given that it may create upward pressure on costs.

It is also not obvious as to the basis for any premium that could arise from such borrowing. At best, such borrowing could only be appropriate for the State at current rates that apply, for example, to the State savings or indeed the cost of debt funding. Otherwise, the State would fund borrowing at a higher cost than at present, either via normal borrowing mechanisms or State savings. There are also concerns about adding to the overall debt of the State.

I refer the Senator to Ireland’s State savings products, which are managed through the National Treasury Management Agency. Crucially, and directly relevant to the matter raised by the Senator today, all savings invested in this way are available to the Exchequer to fund Government expenditure, including the delivery of major Irish public infrastructure projects. They are borrowings by the State from its citizens to form part of the national debt of Ireland. Repayment of all Ireland’s State savings money is a direct, unconditional obligation of the Irish Government.

Ireland possesses a high savings deposit rate which reflects the success of our economy for our citizens in recent years. As the Senator may be aware, at EU level, the European Commission recently launched the savings and investment union strategy, which includes measures to advance the capital markets union project. The savings and investment union seeks to increase investment in the economy and promote EU companies' competitiveness through various measures, such as supporting the development of national capital markets, revitalising and securitisation of the market, increasing retail investor participation in capital markets and promoting SME investment. Ireland is a strong supporter of the SIU initiative and is actively involved in its development, including measures specifically designed to promote more retail investment across the Union.

I thank the Minister of State for his contribution. I know the area is not his own and that it is that of the Minister, Paschal Donohoe, as he alluded to. I find the response rather disappointing. While I take a point about the State savings scheme, if we have a resource of €170 billion sitting on deposit that makes very little interest for those savers, surely it is a resource the State should look at utilising. Other European countries have gone down this road, and I just named France as one, and it has proven very successful. When we have €170 billion that makes little or no return for deposit holders currently, any kind of interest rate to them is better than what they currently get, and surely it is cheap money we could use to utilise and fund much-needed infrastructural investment across the board and State.

I thank the Senator for raising this matter again. As I said in my opening statement, the State already provides a mechanism to its citizens to support the Exchequer through the State savings scheme, and the Government can use that funding to invest in infrastructural projects which we all agree are much needed in our country. The remarks from the Minister for Finance point to the fact that any savings that might be used by the State in an alternative mechanism to derive a higher return for depositors ultimately would go on the Government debt and would result in the State having to repay those sums. There is a feeling that it would not add anything more than what is already done through the State savings mechanism. Nonetheless, I appreciate the comments the Senator made, which I will take back to the Minister for Finance.