I welcome the Minister of State, Deputy O'Donnell, to the House.

I sincerely thank the Cathaoirleach for selecting this Commencement matter today. I also thank the Minister of State, Deputy O'Donnell, for coming to the House to take the debate. I rise today to highlight the urgent and ongoing challenges faced by people in Ireland living with inflammatory bowel disease, particularly Crohn's disease and ulcerative colitis. I call for action to address gaps in awareness, services and financial supports. Last week marked world IBD day, a day to raise awareness and give a voice to those living with these conditions. For many this is not something they think about once a year but their reality every single day.

I will begin with real story. A member of my office, Jason Dyland, began experiencing severe abdominal pain and weight loss two years ago. Like many people he initially hoped it would pass but it did not. What followed was a long and difficult journey, multiple GP visits, multiple scans and tests and multiple hospital admissions. Despite this, many results came back inconclusive and at times he felt dismissed. Many thought he was faking illness when in reality he was faking being well. Eventually he was diagnosed with Crohn's disease. His experience is not unique and reflects a wider problem in how we diagnose and support people with IBD.

Inflammatory bowel disease affects at least 40,000 people in Ireland. It is a chronic lifelong condition that is often invisible but deeply debilitating. Symptoms include severe abdominal pain, fatigue and urgent frequent use of the bathroom. On their worst days people may need to use the bathroom more than ten times. It is often described as living with food poisoning every day. Diagnosis can take far too long. Many patients experience delays and a significant number end up in emergency departments before receiving answers. This points to clear gaps in early detection and awareness.

Beyond the physical symptoms the emotional toll is significant. This is not an easy condition to talk about; there is stigma, embarrassment and isolation. Many people struggle with anxiety and depression yet access to mental health supports remains limited. There are also everyday challenges that many of us rarely consider. Leaving the house, going to work or travelling can require careful planning around something as basic as access to a toilet. Most patients believe our public spaces do not adequately meet these needs. This impacts people's independence and their quality of life. The healthcare gaps are equally concerning. Patients report difficulty in accessing specialist supports such as dieticians and appropriate follow-up care. Confidence in primary care is mixed and people often spend significant time navigating the system without feeling fully supported.

One of the most pressing issues is the financial burden. Despite being serious lifelong conditions, Crohn's disease and ulcerative colitis are not covered under the long-term illness scheme. As a result, many patients face substantial out-of-pocket costs for education and care, often running into thousands of euro each year. A significant number experience financial hardship and some are forced to delay treatment due to cost. This is deeply concerning and very unfair.

IBD also affects people during key stages of life, particularly young adulthood. It has a real impact on education, employment and career progression. Many are forced to reduce hours, change roles or pass on opportunities because of fatigue and unpredictable symptoms. Today I ask for more than an acknowledgement; I ask for action. We need to see earlier and more efficient diagnosis pathways, greater awareness and understanding of IBD, improved access to specialist and mental health supports, better public infrastructure, particularly access to toilets and, critically, a review of financial supports, including consideration of including IBD in the long-term illness scheme.

I thank Senator Murphy O’Mahony for raising this important issue. I am taking this Commencement matter on behalf of the Minister for Health, Deputy Jennifer Carroll MacNeill.

Inflammatory bowel disease, IBD, is the name used for a group of disorders that cause inflammation of the intestine. It is a term used for conditions known as ulcerative colitis, Crohn's disease, and indeterminate colitis. I hope Jason is doing well. Is he still a member of the Senator's staff?

He is.

I wish him well.

I thank the Minister of State.

Approximately 50,000 people in Ireland suffer from IBD. The national clinical programme for gastroenterology and hepatology was established in October 2019 as a joint collaboration between the HSE and the Royal College of Physicians of Ireland, RCPI. Gastroenterology and hepatology multidisciplinary teams, MDTs, provide expertise in the diagnosis, treatment and prevention of conditions of the digestive tract, liver and pancreas, including inflammatory bowel disease. The HSE advised that as of May 2026, all level 4 hospitals, in addition to Connolly Hospital and Mercy University Hospital, which is level 3, have gastroenterology MDTs.

In relation to supports for patients, people who cannot, without undue hardship, arrange for the provision of medical services for themselves and their dependants may be eligible for a medical card under the General Medical Services, GMS, scheme. In accordance with the provisions of the Health Act 1970, as amended, eligibility for a medical card is determined by the HSE. In certain circumstances, the HSE may exercise discretion and grant a medical card, even though an applicant exceeds the income guidelines, where he or she faces difficult financial circumstances such as extra costs arising from illness. The HSE affords applicants the opportunity to furnish supporting documentation to determine whether undue hardship exists and to fully take account of all relevant circumstances that may benefit them in assessment. In circumstances where an applicant is still over the income limit for a medical card, they are then assessed for a GP visit card, which entitles the applicant to GP visits without charge.

The issue of granting medical card eligibility based on having a particular disability or illness was previously examined in 2014 by the HSE expert panel on medical need and medical card eligibility. The group concluded that it was not feasible, desirable or ethically justifiable to list medical conditions in priority order for medical card eligibility. In following the expert group's advice, a person's means remains the main qualifier for a medical card. Under the drugs payment scheme, DPS, no individual or family pays more than €80 a month towards the cost of approved prescribed medicines. The DPS is not means-tested and is available to anyone ordinarily resident in Ireland.

Access to affordable healthcare services has improved over the last few years. These improvements include reductions in the DPS threshold, expansion of access to free GP care, and the abolition of all public inpatient hospital charges for children and adults. These measures continue to create a health and social care service that offers affordable access to quality healthcare. Finally, individuals may also be entitled to claim tax relief on the cost of their medical expenses, including medicines prescribed by a doctor, dentist, or consultant. Relief is available at the standard tax rate of 20%.

I note the other points the Senator raised in respect of the long-term illness card in terms of public transport and access to public facilities in respect of public toilets and bathrooms and so forth. Obviously, the Government keeps these aspects under active consideration.

I thank the Minister of State. I suppose we can agree that a lot has been done but there is more to do regarding this issue. I will finish by paying tribute to Jason who works along with me in my office. By telling his story, he has opened the doors for many others to feel not alone.

People living with IBD are managing a condition that is unpredictable, exhausting and often invisible to others. They deserve a system that recognises that reality and responds to it. Jason’s story and the experience of thousands of people across Ireland should not be defined by delays, gaps or barriers. It should be defined by timely care, dignity and proper support.

I again thank Senator Murphy O'Mahony for raising the issue of the ongoing struggles faced by people living in Ireland with inflammatory bowel disease.

I am taking this Commencement matter on behalf of the Minister for Health and will convey this to her on the Senator's behalf. The other matter she raised would be relevant to other Departments and Ministers. There are measures in place to reduce the cost burden of coping with long-term illness. The Government remains committed to improving healthcare services, providing for each citizen of Ireland.

Inflammatory bowel disease has been highlighted as an area of utmost importance through the work of the national clinical programme for gastroenterology and hepatology, shown throughout the development of the IBD working group, which is comprised of consultants, nurses, allied healthcare professionals, including dietitians and psychologists, and a patient representative. The key output from the working group has been the development of an IBD modernised care pathway. This care pathway will service patients, both adults and children, presenting with consistent gastrointestinal symptoms lasting more than six weeks, abdominal pain, indigestion, changes in bowel habit, internal bleeding, nausea, loss of appetite and loss of weight, and patients with a known diagnosis of family bowel disease. The Government remains committed to improving access to care for acute and chronic diseases such as inflammatory bowel disease through Sláintecare healthcare reforms.

I appreciate the selection of this Commencement matter. I have been attempting to raise this for a number of months and feel particularly strongly about it. I thank the Minister of State for coming in to take the matter on behalf of the Minister for agriculture. In October 2021, Senator Vincent P. Martin introduced a Bill that unanimously passed this House to ban the import of honeybees into Ireland. To give a background reason for wanting to implement such a ban, northern Europe, from Poland to Ireland, France and Scandinavia, up until 100 or 150 years ago, was the home of the northern European black honeybee, Apis mellifera mellifera in Latin. Over the past 150 years, the range of this species of bee has declined and declined further and further, with the introduction of Mediterranean and Asian strains of honeybee into Europe. There is one last remaining stronghold of the northern European black honeybee in the world, which is Ireland.

In recent years, imports of queen bees of different strains have increasingly diluted the pure genes of our native honeybee. To explain how difficult it is to control, when bees mate and breed, they are not like livestock. They are not like horses, cattle or sheep, where the bull is put in the same field as the cow the farmer wants it to mate with, or a stallion with a mare, or a ram with a ewe. We cannot control the way that bees mate. When a virgin queen bee is ready to mate, she flies out of the hive and to a bee congregation area, where she will mate with between eight and 20 drone bees from a number of different colonies in the vicinity, and then return, mated, to her parent colony. The beekeeper has no control over the mating process. Therefore we have no ability to keep the strain of bees pure once non-native bees are present in the vicinity. A number of companies across Europe are marketing non Apis mellifera mellifera queens to be sold into Ireland. Beekeepers here, again and again, choose to buy those bees, and they are endangering the last true remaining stock of northern European honeybees.

With every year that passes, the percentage of pure Apis mellifera mellifera in our national gene pool decreases in comparison with the non-native strain. Very soon, the scales will be tipped beyond the point of no return. Whenever the percentage in the gene pool reaches a certain level, we cannot recover, and we are very close to that point.

Not only must this ban be introduced for the protection of the pure strains of indigenous bees but we also must think about the threat of disease and parasites coming with the import of bees. Back in the late 1990s or early 2000s the varroa mite was accidentally introduced to this island. My God, how we wish we could turn the clock back and implement the ban before that parasitic mite decimated our bees in the 1990s and early 2000s. The warning was there. The Government at the time was warned we needed a ban on the introduction of bees but there was no action. Now we have the tropilaelaps mite, which is a much more dangerous mite, on the edge of Europe. It will absolutely decimate our bees if we do not implement a ban as soon as possible.

I have four questions for the Minister of State. Will the Government support this Bill? If it will I want to know when and if it will not I would like to know why. The required research has been done. Does the Department consider that a robust scientific and legal basis for legislative action based on the findings of this research now exists and does the Government intend to amend the Bill in any way based on the research's findings? Given the imminent threat posed by the tropilaelaps, mite does the Department intend to implement an interim ban on the importation of honeybees as soon as possible as a precautionary measure? Will the full assessment of the research by the Department of Agriculture, Food and the Marine's independent experts be released together with the results of the research delivered in December 2024?

I thank the Senator. Before the Minister of State replies I welcome guests of Senator Cosgrove's office. They are an ecumenical group which includes Fr. Laurence Cullen who is parish priest of Geevagh and Highwood in Sligo, Mark Flener who is visiting from the US and Celia Dunne and her husband, the Right Reverend Dermot Dunne, dean of Christchurch Cathedral, who will be retiring from his role this September. We wish you the very best in your retirement and I hope you are all enjoying your visit.

The Minister of State may go ahead.

A Chathaoirligh, I join you in your sentiments towards the guests in the Public Gallery.

I thank Senator Murphy for raising this important issue. I am taking it on behalf of the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine, Deputy Heydon. The Protection of the Native Irish Honey Bee Bill 2021, which the Senator referenced, is a Private Members' Bill currently before Dáil Éireann on Second Stage and is subject to procedures of the Oireachtas. The Bill aims to ban the importation of non-native species or sub-species of, and strains derived from, Apis mellifera.

Trade in bees is permitted and governed by EU law. EU animal health regulations set down rules for entry of bees into and movement within the EU. These EU regulations contain specific provisions to safeguard the health of bees located in the territory of the Union. All imported bees are accompanied by a health certificate issued by the country of export. There are approximately 4,400 active beekeepers in Ireland maintaining approximately 27,000 colonies of bees. A number of these beekeepers are commercial beekeepers who outsource the breeding and selection of bees and therefore rely on the importation of honeybees. Nevertheless, there has been a steady decline in the number of honeybees imported into Ireland over the past few years. There are concerns that a statutory ban on bee imports into Ireland could constitute a restriction on trade under EU regulations. Accordingly, further legal advice was sought on the compatibility of the Bill with EU Single Market rules. Following receipt of this advice, which recommended a scientific review, the Department of Agriculture, Food and the Marine sought tenders for research services on the native Irish honeybee, Apis mellifera mellifera . The tender sought independent scientific evidence in the form of a comprehensive assessment of the threat to the native Irish honeybee and the impact upon biodiversity and the ecosystem from the crossing and cross-breeding of the native Irish honeybee with non-native species or sub-species of and strains derived from Apis mellifera imported to Ireland.

In October 2023, a contract was signed with the National University of Ireland Galway, NUIG, for the provision of research services on the native Irish honeybee, Apis mellifera mellifera . The research work concluded in December 2024 and the research report was subsequently evaluated by an external expert. Following the completion of the evaluation, the research service provider, NUIG, was afforded the opportunity to respond to the evaluator's comments and these comments were received in September 2025. The Department of Agriculture, Food and the Marine is currently finalising the overall response to the report.

The Government is very supportive of beekeepers and beekeeping associations in their efforts to conserve the native Irish honeybee. The Exchequer-funded grants to Irish national beekeepers' federations provides an annual grant to the four Irish national beekeepers' federations. In 2025, the four national beekeeping federations received a total of €25,500 through this measure for initiatives, including the conservation of the native Irish honeybee. Funding has also been provided for the conservation of the native Irish honeybee under conservation of plant and animal genetic resources scheme. Irish beekeeping is supported through the provision of grant aid for capital investments by individual beekeepers in specialised beekeeping-related equipment and structures, including specialised bee breeding equipment. Lastly, €121,000 was paid out under the national apiculture programme in 2025 to support beekeeping through an approved applied research project.

I thank the Minister of State for his reply. Speaking as somebody who worked for over 20 years as a commercial beekeeper, I am aware of the fact that bee imports into Ireland are reducing, but reducing is not enough. They have to be stopped completely. When it comes to introducing disease, parasites and breeding that cannot be controlled once it is in the country, the only acceptable number of imports is zero. That can only be achieved with a complete ban on the import of bees.

NUIG fulfilled the requirement of answering the report in September 2025. That was nine months ago. It is past time for that report, its findings and the response to the report to be published by the Department. We do not know where we are going until we know the findings of that. Their publication is long overdue. I urge the Minister of State to work with the Department and the Minister for agriculture to ensure the publication of that report as soon as possible.

I thank Senator Murphy again for raising this matter. As I stated, I am taking this on behalf of the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine, Deputy Martin Heydon. The Minister fully recognises the important role played by honeybees, especially in terms of honey production and the pollination of horticultural crops. The Department of Agriculture, Food and the Marine is fully supportive of the work carried out by beekeepers and the beekeeping association in relation to the conservation of the native Irish honeybee, which is evident in the level of support provided through various initiatives. The Minister appreciates the concerns among beekeepers' associations that it has taken time for the outcome of the research to be published, but wishes to assure the House that his Department is currently finalising the overall response to the report. The points Senator Murphy made today will be brought to the attention of the Minister and the Department of agriculture.

The next Commencement matter was submitted by Senator Boyhan, but we are waiting for the Minister of State to arrive as there is a vote in the Dáil. While we are waiting on the Minister of State, Deputy Emer Higgins, I welcome the guests of Senator Lorraine Clifford-Lee. They are very welcome. When students visit the House, we usually give them the day off homework, but I think there are only one or two guests who have homework.

We will give you the day off work.

Exactly. They are very welcome. I hope they have been well-looked-after. I am sure they are.

Will Senator Murphy propose that the House suspends for the duration of the vote in the Dáil?

I propose that the House suspends for the duration of the vote in the Dáil.

Is that agreed? Agreed.

I welcome the Minister of State to the House. She is here on behalf of the Minister for Children, Disability and Equality, Deputy Foley, who, I understand, is tied up with parliamentary business and cannot be here today.

I am very conscious that the national housing strategy for disabled people 2022-27 provides a framework for the delivery of housing for people with all levels of disability. I also understand, of course, that housing is ultimately the responsibility of the Minister for housing and is not the responsibility of the Minister, Deputy Foley. However, there is a level of dovetailing or cross-interest here in the sense that the Department of Children, Disability and Equality actually funds the provision of supports for community living in collaboration with the HSE. There is a crossover there and I want to acknowledge the excellent collaboration between the two Departments and the two Ministers.

I was prompted to raise this as a Commencement matter because about ten days ago there was an headline in the Irish Examiner which read, "Councils now have to set housing delivery targets for disabled people". That struck a chord with me. The article in the Irish Examiner referred to the Minister, Deputy Foley, and to a statement or contribution she made at the Fianna Fáil Ard-Fheis. That statement was carried in Monday's papers. The article referred to a game changing new policy that will be "aimed at two groups - people who are able to live independently with some supports, and people who need specialist 24-7 wraparound care". The Minister of State, having spoken about these issues previously, knows the importance of having both. We want people to live independently, if at all possible but we recognise that is not possible for everyone. We recognise the policy of decongregation of institutional settings and understand the importance of wraparound services for people who have limited ability or limited access to supports. There is no one-size-fits-all course that works for everyone so there has to be flexibility in supports and provisions for people who want to live in their community. We all want to enable people to live and play a full and meaningful role within their own communities as much as possible but we also recognise, as do disability advocates and those with a disability, that they need supports.

The practice of emptying out fully residential support systems without providing wraparound supports has not worked. I am very familiar with a number of charities, which I will not mention here, that embarked on the emptying out of old, unsuitable institutional buildings. They put people in one-bedroom units, particularly around the greater Dublin area. People had been institutionalised in settings for a long time and suddenly after weeks there were no supports. Supports fell away. The novelty wore off. I think we have done a lot of learning there.

I also liked what the Minister, Deputy Foley, said, that for far too long disabled people have not been a priority for social and affordable housing. I think we will all agree with that. She mentioned the role of local authorities and the significance of that, and then mentioned the targets. Unless we measure this, and we set targets for all our local authorities, it is simply not going to happen. I commend the Minister, Deputy Foley, in particular on the initiative, although it is a Government initiative. We recognise that too many people with disabilities are not being enabled to play a full and meaningful role in the community in the way they wish. We also hear that it ties in with choice as regards where they want to live and the level of support they want.

It is a point worth making here again, although it is not part of the Commencement matter, that far too many people with a disability who want to work cannot get work. There is a bigger picture here. Today our focus is on housing and the collaboration between the Ministers, Deputies Foley and Browne. To follow all that initiative and support, we must put the money in place. I would be very interested to hear the Minister of State's response and am grateful to her for coming here this afternoon to deal with this matter.

I would like to thank Senator Boyhan for raising this important issue and for giving me the opportunity to respond on behalf of the both the Minister, Deputy Foley, and me. We are both in the Department of Children, Disability and Equality.

As the Senator mentioned, the national housing strategy for disabled people provides the framework for the delivery of housing for people with all levels of disability. While the housing response itself falls within the remit of the Department of Housing, Local Government and Heritage, as the Senator has said, the Department of Children, Disability and Equality funds the provision of supports for community living, as well as supports for more complex specialist disability residential services, with the services provided either directly by the HSE or on behalf of the HSE by service providers.

The overall budget increase from €1.7 billion at the close of 2017 to close to €3.9 billion this year for specialist disability services reflects the programme for Government commitment to improving the lives of people with disabilities, signalling to those with a disability that this Government is committed to making a difference in their lives.

Specialist disability services that people with disabilities may need to live in local authority homes include disability residential services, personal assistance and home support. That is where the dovetailing the Senator spoke about comes in. In 2026, €65 million has been allocated to disability residential services for new developments, which includes €40 million that will provide in the region of 199 residential responses, and will also cover the 152 new residential placements. The remaining €25 million will support in the region of 40 residential packages for children in care with complex needs, the enhancement of existing residential placements, decongregation transitions, which the Senator mentioned, and the under 65s programme.

Other key supports that people with disabilities may need to live in local authority homes include home support and personal assistance services. The budget this year also provided €5 million to support the delivery of over 100,000 additional home support and 50,000 additional personal assistance hours, enabling approximately 7,000 people to receive disability home support services and almost 3,000 adults to receive personal assistance to maintain their independence.

As the Senator mentioned, the Ministers, Deputies Foley and Browne, along with their officials, have made significant progress, through the implementation structures established under the national housing strategy for disabled people, in improving co-ordination with the local authorities and disability service providers at local, regional and national level. This includes establishing the levels of unmet need for specialist disability residential services in each county or local authority area. This will inform the setting of targets in the local authority housing development action plans for two cohorts of disabled people, namely those living more independently in the community, and those with greater support needs, who will receive specialist disability residential services.

As the Senator said, if we do not have targets in place, it will be hard to motivate people to reach them. It is also very hard to measure the progress. I am a big believer in them and welcome them.

The Senator might also be interested to know that the HSE has established new housing co-ordinator roles and new residential planning and review teams. These are currently being hired for and will be in place this year to co-ordinate and oversee the delivery and planning of new residential placements and future placements, many of which will be delivered by local authority homes. At present, this is very much a crisis response, and we are very aware that we want to move towards a more sustained, planned response.

The Senator mentioned disabled people and work in his comments. I visited a service yesterday in Celbridge called Dara, which has a fantastic work-ready programme. Unfortunately, the level of disabled people in our workforce is currently at only 17%, but Dara has translated that 17% to 74% in its service.

There are very positive things happening around the country, and it is important we also shine a light on those.

I thank the Minister of State and ask her to convey my thanks to the Minister, Deputy Foley, for the response.

Key to all of this is, of course, the local authority and, as the Minister of State said, the housing development action plans. I do not know where they are, and if they are just about to start; it is pretty new. It would be interesting to keep an eye on that and let us all look at it again. Independent living, independent dignity, respect for the individual to make choices around their needs, accommodation, etc., are very important, and key to all of that is their being placed at the centre and heart of our communities, and to be supported in it all.

Clearly, the Minister of State's response emphasises the importance of ensuring we continue to support people with disabilities to live meaningful and fulfilling lives through their choices, direction and chosen pathways, with a person-centred approach across the services, tapping into the multi-community services.

Finally, I acknowledge that significant levels of funding will be required to roll this out over a period. It is not going to happen today or tomorrow, and that is a key ask. I ask the Minister of State to take back to the Minister my desire, and I am sure everyone's desire, that this be kept in focus as we run into the budget. This area needs resources and funding.

I thank the Minister of State and the Minister, Deputy Foley, for their comprehensive response.

I thank the Senator for that, and for everything he does to raise these very important issues.

I reiterate this is a priority for this Government. The Government recognises there is more to do to improve the lived experience of people with disabilities, and that is ultimately what this boils down to. The Senator set out in his own contribution that people are at the heart of this, and that is why we need to ensure we are doubling down on our efforts.

The increase in the disability budget for this year, which is 20%, demonstrates the multiple commitments made in the programme for Government to improving the lives of people with disabilities and making a difference. We need to ensure that funding translates into improved outcomes and expanded services.

I reiterate the importance of ensuring we continue to support people with disabilities to live meaningful and fulfilling lives, with a person-centred approach right across all our services. The ambition of Government is to bring about a step change in services for people with a disability in Ireland, and we are committed to the expansion and reform of disability services to maximise people's independence, to help support them to live ordinary lives in ordinary places.

The bottom line is the Government is aware of the challenges, which present across all regional health areas. The Department is actively engaging with the Department of housing and the HSE to explore new and existing ways of responding to demand, while appropriately managing the significant levels of funding provided to residential services.

The Minister of State, Deputy Brophy, is outside, so we will just swap over now.

I thank the Minister of State for coming in today. I call Senator Ruane.

I want to raise the issue of the planned introduction of a flat fee for criminal legal aid.

I note similar flat fees have been introduced in other areas of law such as family law and they have been heavily criticised. What particularly concerns me in relation to these proposals is a flat fee of €455 regardless of the number of appearances before the court. This is not so much in relation to a debate or conversation about how much legal representatives should or should not earn, but access to justice for some of the most vulnerable people who may end up in front of the courts. When these proposals came in, one of the assessments made in relation to 350,000 cases in the District Court from 2022 to 2023 found that the average number of appearances in criminal legal aid, CLA, cases is 5.04 compared with 3.24 for non-criminal aid cases. Comparing criminal aid cases to more simplistic, straightforward cases is not a good mechanism or measurement for how we ensure people have good, solid access to justice.

A principle I believe in, as do the Department and many other justice bodies, is prison as a last resort. If we have prison as a last resort, especially when it comes to criminal legal aid cases, what we are doing is creating a scenario where there is an expectation to have matters dealt with more quickly to match non-criminal aid cases. As the Minister of State can imagine, some of those cases are not going to cut having three or four appearances in court such as, for instance, people experiencing addiction, language barriers, people with severe mental health issues or intellectual disabilities or whatever the complexity of the case and the need may be. To give some reality to that, in one particular case among the cases I have looked at, there were eight appearances before the court. That may have included a probation report. The person may appear again when the probation report is not ready and the case is then adjourned again and again. In some cases it might be said that solicitors are delaying cases but many of these cases are found to be State-led in terms of delays.

Another case I looked at was from 24 April 2025. The number of adjournments between that date and 6 November 2025 was 21. Can the Minister of State imagine that a solicitor receiving €455 for a total of 20-odd cases is going to be able to provide adequate support to that individual who has severe mental health and psychiatric issues? At one point in the case he was unable to plead due to his unwellness. These things obviously tick on and on. Can the Minister of State imagine a solicitor being faced with a case like this, which has complexities, whether poverty or trauma or whatever it may be, and in this scenario telling him or her that €455 is the fee? That is not even the out-of-court aspect and it has nothing to do with prison visits that may be needed to build the case and adequately support the individual.

This is of real concern to some of the most vulnerable people who may end up before the courts. Whatever about the access to justice they may receive, we may also see, as we have in other areas of law, people leaving the legal aid system and saying it is not feasible for them to be able to work within it. What we are doing is creating a shrinking pool of access to justice for some of the most vulnerable people in the country. We cannot really say we have a system built on fair access to justice and legal aid if we are saying there could be a case with more than 20 adjournments in which we expect a solicitor to work for €455 and treat that person with the detail and care he or she needs across those adjournments.

I thank the Senator. It is important to remember that the programme for Government contains three commitments in relation to criminal legal aid, namely, to reform the operation of the criminal legal aid scheme; restore the fees, and enact the criminal justice (legal aid) Bill. It is the Minister, Deputy O'Callaghan’s intention to fulfil all three commitments. The Minister fully recognises the crucial role played by the legal profession in the effective administration of criminal justice. Equally, the criminal legal aid scheme is fundamental to upholding the constitutional human right to a legal defence.

The Minister's only objective in making these reforms is to make the system more effective and efficient while ensuring that those accused of crimes, including those who are vulnerable or disadvantaged, are provided with the legal representation to which they are constitutionally entitled.

The reform of the criminal legal aid fee structure in the District Court will not affect the ability of legal professionals to engage in criminal legal aid work. Neither is it intended to reduce the cost to the State of providing criminal legal aid. Rather, it will improve efficiencies, reduce unnecessary adjournments, simplify the administration of criminal legal aid, speed up case resolution and enable faster payments to practitioners. For cases in the District Court, regardless of the number of appearances, a set fee will be payable to solicitors. The new structure will also provide for a full separate set fee for each defendant in court on a given day. This reform will be a major improvement on the current fee structure.

In considering the need for reform, it is important to note that while criminal case volumes in the District Court have decreased, expenditure on criminal legal aid in the District Court has nearly doubled, from €19 million in 2015 to €37 million in 2024. The Department of Justice, Home Affairs and Migration reviewed more than 350,000 District Court cases which took place during 2022 and 2023. The reforms aim to address structural issues identified during this review, such as unnecessary adjournments resulting from the payment-per-appearance model, which also impact those who are vulnerable or disadvantaged.

The Department of Justice, Home Affairs and Migration has been engaging extensively with relevant stakeholders, including An Garda Síochána, the Probation Service and the Courts Service, as well as legal professionals and their representative bodies, on the review and proposed changes to the scheme. Officials from the Department met with the Bar Council and the Law Society in May, July and October 2025 and again in March 2026. The Minister, Deputy O'Callaghan, has written to those two bodies recently offering to meet with them to discuss the proposals.

I know from reading the submission made by the Law Society that it also asserts this is a flawed proposal. When we think of efficiency, I am sure there are plenty of unnecessary adjournments in some cases, but in many there are not. As a community worker, I always try to portray to people whom we go to for funding that you cannot measure human interaction in efficiency or number of outcomes, number of adjournments or number of cases. It is a matter of how you work with individuals on a day-to-day basis, especially when we look at the courts system. In Ireland we say we have a rehabilitative system, whereby we might look at young people and vulnerable adults and often try to create other pathways for them out of the criminal justice system. However, you could be saying, "We need unnecessary adjournments", but your solicitor could be saying, "We need some adjournments because we have just got this person to register with their local youth centre and they are going to start a course in a community college." However, now you have only a flat fee and all of a sudden you cannot put in all those structures to make sure that person exits the criminal justice system and has what they need.

Finally, can the Minister of State say if any engagement took place with the District Court judges, who administer the system day in and day out, before the Department came up with these proposals?

I will convey the Senator's remarks on this to the Minister, Deputy O'Callaghan. As mentioned, the reform of the criminal legal aid fee structure in the District Court is aimed primarily at improving efficiencies, speeding up case resolution and reducing unnecessary adjournments, while ensuring that those accused of crimes, including those who are vulnerable or disadvantaged, are provided with the legal representation to which they are constitutionally entitled. The proposed reform is intended to make the system work better for all concerned. The Minister, Deputy O'Callaghan, looks forward to continuing engagement with the relevant stakeholders and representatives of the legal profession in advance of the introduction of new arrangements, including the full restoration of fees, which is due on 1 July.

I welcome the visitors and guests of Deputy James O'Connor. You are very welcome. I hope you are being well looked after in the Dáil restaurant and the bar.