They do not pay rates. We are going to take a look at that.

I move: Vote 32 - Business, Enterprise and Innovation (Revised) That a sum not exceeding €1,401,200,000 be granted to defray the charge which will come in course of payment during the year ending on the 31st day of December, 2020, for the salaries and expenses of the Office of the Minister for Business, Enterprise and Innovation, including certain services administered by that Office, for the payment of certain subsidies and grants and for the payment of certain grants under cash-limited schemes and that a sum not …

I will respond to as many of the Deputy's questions as I can now and perhaps revert to her other queries by correspondence. I am two days in the job and I am not across everything just yet but I promise I will get there very soon. With regard to the supports that are in place for businesses, there is a very long list of them but they really fall into four major categories, one being the wage subsidy scheme whereby the Government is paying the wages of the best part of 500,000 staff, the restart grant, the rates wai…

If the Deputy wants to go over the details of the restart grant, which have been provided to her, 34,000 businesses have claimed it so far but only €61 million has been drawn down. This Estimate, if passed today, will provide €250 million. That still leaves the best part of €180 million to be drawn down. We are not dealing with the July stimulus plan today. That will require a further Estimate down the road. We are examining matters such as an extension to the wage subsidy scheme, an extension of the rates waiver, …

I am afraid I do not know what the Deputy means by "arbitrary" in this context. The way the restart grant works is that a business has its rates refunded. If a business did not pay rates, then it is not arbitrary for that business to not get a rates rebate. It is a common sense approach but that is not to say there are not other schemes that might help businesses. For example, there is a scheme for people who are sole traders or are self-employed and who do not pay rates but they can get a grant of about €1,000 if …

I thank the Deputy for her contribution. I may be able to answer a few of her points but I will have to come back to her on others. As things stand, the grants and loans offered, including the restart grant, the wage subsidy scheme and the various loan schemes, are not tied to any particular environmental or social obligations. That may well be the case in the future. Down the line, we might decide not to bail out polluting industries, for example. For the moment, we have taken a blanket approach to try to support …

It is not business as usual in the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment. We have the wage subsidy scheme, which is a massive and unprecedented scheme such as I have never seen in my lifetime. The State is essentially paying the wages of the best part of 500,000 employees in private sector firms so that they have retained their jobs. Nearly €2 billion has been paid out to date. It is one of the better schemes internationally, and that is not the case with every scheme we have introduced. It is money that i…

I am aware of the High Court judgment. My officials and the Attorney General's office are currently studying it. We will make a decision in the next couple of days on whether or not to appeal it. We have until 14 July to appeal. I say to anyone who works in those sectors, be it in construction, contract cleaning, electrical contracting or anyone covered by an SEO or an ERO, that their employer does not have the right to change the terms and conditions on foot of this judgment. There is a stay on its execution. We w…

I believe that fraud is fraud, be it welfare fraud, tax fraud or companies gaming Government grants. I take the same dim view of fraud, whether it is committed by an individual or by a company. I do not take the view, as I have seen some Deputies to my left do, that some forms of fraud are okay because of the social class of the person committing that fraud. That is a rather perverse way of thinking. Fraud is wrong, whether it is welfare fraud, tax fraud or corporate fraud, and it should be treated just the same. R…

Just a brief response. I thank the Deputy for his contribution and his support for the Revised Estimates. He made a point that I agree with absolutely, namely, that what is being done today is not enough. He is right. These are Revised Estimates to allow us to pay for what has already been announced, but we will make further announcements as part of the July stimulus package. That will require a further Supplementary Estimate from the House for us to provide additional grants, supports and loan guarantees to busine…

I do not like to see any business cutting people's pay and I know the Deputy does not either and nor does anyone in the House. The reason a company qualifies for the wage subsidy scheme is because it cannot afford to pay the wages. While most companies are topping up the wage subsidy scheme, some cannot even afford to do so. This is the situation we are in. We have had an enormous shock to our economy and the reason these companies, many of which used to be very successful and profitable, qualify at all for the wag…

The Deputy and I appreciate that every business is different. In speaking about them in the way we are, we are very much generalising. I would not use the term "reasonable". I would say it is regrettable if any company has to reduce the pay of staff. It should only do so if it genuinely has to and we both agree on that. Certainly it is preferable to see reductions in pay rather than having people laid off altogether and I believe the Deputy would agree with this also. Earlier, the Deputy suggested that companies sh…

I thank the Deputy for his contribution. Something he mentioned that I strongly identify and agree with is the extent to which our food supply chains proved to be very robust. I recall the earliest part of this crisis, during which one of the things we were worried about as a Government was supply chains and, in particular, food supply chains. They turned out to be really robust, and that is a credit to everyone involved. Whether in our ports or warehouses, logistics or haulage, everybody has managed to make sure t…

Regarding guidelines for pubs, nightclubs and other businesses that do not serve food, they will be allowed to reopen, all things going to plan, in phase 4, which is due to begin on 20 July. Usually we have the guidelines out a week or two before the start date of a new phase - I do not know for sure, but that is generally when one would expect to see them - to give people the opportunity to prepare. On the issue of redundancies, that is a matter for the Minister, Deputy Humphreys, rather than me and my Department …

I thank the Acting Cathaoirleach.

I will be very quick. The €6 million for Shannon Airport was approved by Cabinet last week. It is mainly for infrastructure works. I think the airport will need additional state aid and support in the coming months because of the unprecedented situation we are in. I will study the potential anomalies in the wage subsidy scheme. I really regret that Shannon Heritage has chosen to close some of those sites. I have been in touch with Deputy Carey about this. What it has said to us is that it is largely dependent on No…

We informed the world that rates were being waived for companies that had to close for that three-month period. We may have to consider extending that waiver. I do not know why Dublin City Council has not been formally informed but I will check that out. Regarding SMEs, the plan is a mix of grants and loans. Grants are available, such as the restart grant, which the Deputy mentioned, but I think we will need more grants. The biggest support for employers big and small has been the wage subsidy scheme and €2 billion…

I have a very strong view that every Minister should see himself or herself as having a national remit. As a Dublin-based politician, I am very aware of my responsibility to be a national Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment, and that is exactly what I will be. It is what I tried to do, as best as I could, as Taoiseach. When I was appointing my Cabinet three years ago, we had two senior members from the west. However, when there are three parties involved and, perhaps, not co-ordinating things as well as t…

I know Deputy Naughten has a particular interest in the matter of Aptar and he has been in touch with my office directly, as has Senator Dolan. We do not yet know how many job losses there will be but IDA Ireland and my office will get involved to see what we might be able to do to protect as many of those jobs as we can and see what alternatives can be found, if at all possible.

I am not familiar with the Danish example the Deputy mentioned, but I will be happy to learn more about it. I will check about the marts. I understand from what the Deputy said that they are not included in the scheme. We will examine that and see if it makes sense to include them as part of the July stimulus. I know there are some other examples of companies and businesses that have been excluded, as mentioned by earlier speakers. In regard to Aptar, IDA Ireland is in close contact with the company and has offered…