I move amendment No. 16: In page 14, between lines 21 and 22, to insert the following: “(6) A person appointed as a practising barrister or practising solicitor to be a member of the Commission shall hold office for a term of 3 years from the date of his or her appointment.”.

I move amendment No. 19: In page 15, to delete lines 9 to 11 and substitute the following: “(2) A committee shall consist of such and so many members as the Commission shall determine having an equal number of members who are judges and members who are not judges.”.

I move amendment No. 22a: In page 23, after line 36, to insert the following: Prohibition on publication of confidential information 35. (1) No person shall publish or cause to be made public whether in or outside of the State any matter, information, record or document which is or contains confidential information for the purposes of section 29 or the publication of which by a person to whom section 30 applies would be an offence under that section. (2) A person who contravenes subsection (1) shall be guilty of an…

This amendment is designed to cure a loophole in the legislation, namely, that the provisions on non-disclosure of the information relating to the appointments process are inadequate and have the effect of rendering some of the information capable of being published. If one looks at sections 29 and 30, the former restricts the revelation of material by a person who is a member of the commission or a committee, the director or a member of staff of the office and creates an offence of divulging that information. Sect…

They might be worried now all right. I am perfectly free to put that file out on television because it is possible other people committed no offence. Maybe they left it on a bus or did something stupid like send it to a shredder and it did not get shredded. Any person in the community is free to divulge that same information and make it public. If we get to the stage that documentation which shows the internal running of the commission, the selection process or the marking of interviews, all that kind of stuff, fin…

I regret that response from the Minister. To compare this to Cabinet confidentiality is nonsensical. Cabinet confidentiality applies to many things and it can be breached by a Minister who just briefs a journalist and the journalist is free to say that the Green Party at Cabinet was opposed to this, the Fianna Fáil members were opposed to that or the Fine Gael members supported something else. That can of course be breached. However, here we are dealing with something which the Minister is saying merits a sentence …

To be published means it is in the newspapers.

No.

The person who leaks it to another individual, the person who leaves it on the street and the person who puts it in a brown envelope and gives it to a journalist does very little damage. It is the person who publishes it who does all the damage.

I move amendment No. 25 a : In page 27, line 18, to delete “An applicant” and substitute “A person, including an applicant,”.

This amendment seeks to extend what is provided for on page 27, line 18 to any person, not merely an applicant. The present text reads that an applicant shall not, in relation to the process of selection and recommendation, including any step and so on, canvas or attempt to influence part of the decision. Again, is it legitimate for the applicant’s wife or husband to do it? Is it permissible for a Deputy to do it? Is it permissible for anybody except the applicant to canvas an appointment? This is a perfectly strai…

It now means, for instance, that a judge who is pally with another judge is free to go to judges who are on the Judicial Appointments Commission and say, “Judge Michael McDowell is really the person we need”, so anybody is entitled to canvass in my favour except me or somebody I procure to do it. Is that really what the Minister wants, namely, that members of the Judiciary can canvass the judicial members of the commission and urge them strongly to appoint one person rather than another, and that is legitimate, or …

That is the purpose. If that is the purpose, then let us make it very clear that by simply changing two words, any person who does that, including an applicant, commits that offence. That will stop all canvassing of the kind the Minister is trying to stop. Again, there is a mulishness in regard to this Bill. No amendments at all are taken from this side of the House – nothing. If it were not for the fact that the Minister's name was wrong, this would already have been through both Houses. The Minister has to go bac…

I am replying. I think I am entitled to a reply.

I am entitled to reply to what I heard. The Minister said it is all right for ten judges to go to the Chief Justice and lobby on behalf of one of their colleagues to be appointed. She said it would be spreading the net too wide to stop that. She said it is open to people to write to the commission, who have nothing to do with the judge, urging it to appoint one person rather than another. She also said it is all right for Members of the Oireachtas to canvass the members - including laypersons - in favour of a parti…

I move amendment No. 26: In page 28, between lines 28 and 29, to insert the following: "Right of Government to advise President: consequential vacancies 43. Nothing in this Part affects, limits or inhibits the right of the Government in any case where it advises the President to appoint any member of the Supreme Court, the Court of Appeal, or the High Court to any judicial office in any of those courts to appoint any other such member to the vacancy thereby created without seeking any recommendation from the Commis…

Again, the purpose of this amendment is to rescue the Bill from nonsense. It was pointed out to the then Minister, Deputy Flanagan, that the previous Bill contained the same mistake. If the Government appoints a member of the Court of Appeal or an ordinary member of the Supreme Court to be Chief Justice, a string of vacancies can arise as a result. At present, it is perfectly open to the Government to say that someone has been appointed to the Court of Appeal, which means there is a vacancy and that so-and-so will …

It does not interview anyone.

Section 43(2) reads: "An application for recommendation ... shall not be made ... otherwise than pursuant to an invitation issued under section 42 ." A section 42 invitation can arise only where the Minister requests the commission to make recommendations for appointment to a judicial office where a judicial office stands vacant or he or she reasonably anticipates that there will be a vacancy in a judicial office. If a judge retires or dies before retirement, that does not apply. When Deputy Charles Flanagan was th…

I move amendment No. 27 a : In page 32, between lines 26 and 27, to insert the following: "(6) The Commission shall not recommend any person for appointment to judicial office in the State unless it is satisfied that the person is a citizen of Ireland.".