First, I want to state my unequivocal support for the hot school meals programme. It is a really important programme. I am glad the Minister is doing it and the Department is funding it. The Minister said on RTÉ Radio 1 last week that a third of school meals were not meeting basic nutritional standards, according to the initial assessment carried out by a dietitian appointed by the Minister's Department. Can the Minister confirm whether his Department is worried that once more thorough assessments, including site visits are completed, the figures of compliance may be dramatically below expectations and when those more comprehensive assessment results will be made available?

I thank the Deputy. I have to say that when I was appointed Minister for Social Protection, I did not think a lot of my time would be spent on school meals. It is one of the most popular programmes and most debated in the House. That is a good thing and we want to get it right.

In 2019, there were 37 schools and 6,600 children who were eligible for hot school meals. Today, all 3,200 primary schools and 550,000 children are eligible for hot school meals. There are 3,700 schools around the country which are eligible for the full supports; meaning 3.4 million school meals per week, delivered by more than 300 suppliers, including community-based suppliers. Deputy O’Reilly has championed the role of meals on wheels. Overall, I welcome the Deputy’s support for the success of the programme but we have more to do and we will continue to strive for improvements.

The budget for any hot school meals programme this year is €289 million. To assist in improving the programme, my Department has established an inter-departmental working group, including the Department of Health, the Department of Education and Youth, the Food Safety Authority and the Department of children, to oversee and make recommendations. Last year, I instructed suppliers to remove fats that are high in saturated fat, sugar and salt. Previously they had been permitted once a week and only when chosen by parents. We have also seconded a CORU-registered dietitian, funded by my Department, for the school meals programme. She is under the clinical supervision of the Department of Health and is undertaking an in-depth review of school meals supplier menus and their compliance to nutritional standards. We also last year launched the summer holiday hunger initiative, which supported 42,000 children. I am very focused on the nutritional standards of the hot school meals. There are 16 different standards and we will get a chance to discuss the full details of those during supplementary questions.

I thank the Minister. Some clarity on those guidelines and standards would be very helpful. The Minister mentioned he instructed suppliers to assess certain nutritional values in the meals. This is one of my supplementary questions. The scheme is funded and being evaluated by the Department but my understanding is the contracts are being organised by the schools with the relevant suppliers. What is the role of the Department in the contracting arrangements, for example, if somebody is not living up to the contractual obligations? Does that come to the school or is it something the Department has a role in? What other instructions is the Department able to give? Reliance on private companies more generally can yield benefits in some ways and disadvantages in others. It would be helpful to understand whether there are any plans on how to change that arrangement and get better value for money, better nutritional standards and on the way the Department would like to pursue this.

The dietician has been working since September and she has completed an in-depth review of school meal supplier menus and their compliance with nutritional standards. The nutritional standards have been in place since 2019, since the inception of the programme. They were developed by the Irish Nutrition and Dietetic Institute, the HSE, Safefood and the Food Safety Authority of Ireland. There are 16 standards in total - 13 relating to food and three relating to drinks. The interim report is based effectively on desktop, so we are now beginning, with colleagues from the Department of Social Protection, the process of getting into schools and looking at what is being delivered. The main findings of that interim report, which were based predominantly on looking at menus, is that at least 66% met at least three of the five standards looked at in the initial look. Some 80% contained adequate carbohydrates that did not include foods high in fat, salt and sugar. One of the issues is around fruit and vegetables and how available they are. That was very hard to decipher from the menu. We will have the full report by the summer and I look forward to discussing it.

In regard to our role as a Department, we are also developing an inspection tool. We are getting into schools. We did 400 school inspections last year and another 100 desktop inspections.

I thank the Minister for acknowledging my interest in this, and particularly in the role of meals on wheels, which is in the community, already delivering healthy, nutritious meals to people. I would differ with Deputy Hayes. I do not believe there are benefits to being reliant on the private sector. I think that is a backwards step but we are all different in our own lovely ways. Has the Minister had any formal engagement with the national meals on wheels organisation and if he has not, will he have that formal engagement to see how prepared it is to take on the work? My information, having engaged with it, is that there are plenty who will. There would be a tie-in with community employment schemes and other schemes to support this. I wanted to briefly mention portion sizes. We have talked about this before. It is beyond ridiculous that people in junior infants get the same as those who are in sixth class. The requirements of the kids are vastly different. I hope that is being looked at.

I assure Deputy Hayes that the nutrition side is being closely monitored. Coming back to the overall discussion about suppliers, my preference is for local suppliers. That could be meals on wheels. Deputy O'Shea is with us. The Duhallow community food project is also a very good model. It is locally produced. This day last week, I was in St. Munchin's Community Centre in Limerick, where they do extraordinary work. We saw the food being prepared there. I do not mind whether it is private or public. I think it should be local and, most importantly, nutritious. With our dietitian, we are developing a tool to allow us to do more audits, to actually get into schools and to see what is being served, because what is on a menu may be different from what is being served.

The contract is with the school, which does the contract with companies. I pay tribute to the Department of education and the school meals unit of my own Department. They work incredibly hard and give guidance and support. The contractual relationship is between the school and the supplier, which is important. I make the point to Deputy O'Reilly that I hope, once we finalise the report of our dietitian, to engage with organisations based on having her report and analysis of the potential. As I said, I am open to anything as long as it provides nutrition, but my personal preference is for local.